Scattergun The Rather Wonderful Soo Line - Livery Appreciation Thread

JasonD

Western Thunderer
Here's another CP Bensenville Yard, Chicago 3/06. When Jordan does that to his MP15AC we'll know the SOO can do no wrong ... for him anyway.
Jason IMG_0523.jpg
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Big Train James

Western Thunderer
I'd have to get an MP15AC, first.... :oops:

... and the only wrong the SOO ever did was get fully taken over by CP Rail :( :p ;)
I beg to differ. In my opinion the beginning of the end was the change from curved transition from red nose to sill to the angled transition. It was all down hill from there if you ask me...:(
 

Dog Star

Western Thunderer
... and the only wrong the SOO ever did was get fully taken over by CP Rail
In my opinion the beginning of the end was the change from curved transition from red nose to sill to the angled transition. It was all down hill from there if you ask me..
I prefered 'hockey stick'...
If anything, the real downhill slide started with the MILW takeover...
Just what are you two rabbling on about here?

Being serious, please expand on the history / livery discussion. Maybe in a separate topic?
 

JasonD

Western Thunderer
Oh that's where they've gone. Does that count as an extra post, oh I've already got enough to start small-adding I suppose. Anyway, for those that don't know, the SOO started as the Minneapolis, St Paul and Sault Sainte (usually Ste) Marie and when enough Yanks were calling it the Salt they had to change it. It's a tiny bit like Warships and Westerns having WES painted on the side. No enough tries at jokes, dog walk time. Found the software for my slide-scanner...!
Jason
 

Dog Star

Western Thunderer
Thank you Jordan,

At least three SOO liveries shown here so far and with all in the same pikkie (I think).

... the real downhill slide started with the MILW takeover...
MILW? seems like I need to find Jordan's potted history on all things SOO.
 

oldravendale

Western Thunderer
Now, I don't have any understanding of railways away from these shores, or if they don't involve and element of making a cup of tea, but that is lovely.

Brian
 

Yorkshire Dave

Western Thunderer
White'n'Red was to be replaced from 1989 with all-over Candy Apple Red...

With different style number boards and sub base doors in SOO red, a patch painted repair panel under the road# at the bottom of the cab and I don't think the cab door is Candy Apple red either.

4509 03.jpg
 

Jordan

Mid-Western Thunderer
Yep - Soo Red, Candy Apple Red, CP Rail Red.... they were all different!! :rolleyes:
The two different numberboard styles is quite weird to the eyes isn't it??!! The nearest (rounder) set is a replacement.
Mindyou, scratch away all that paint & it's an ex-MILW unit underneath!! ;)
 

Jordan

Mid-Western Thunderer
A little bit more on the development of the white'n'red livery...
It wasn't a foregone conclusion that these were to be the main colors of the new livery. What was decided was that there would be one main body color, and a second color at one end (usually the front or short hood end; there were exceptions), with all the below-frames stuff - trucks, fuel tanks etc - black. Remember one driving factor was economy; the livery had to be cheap to apply. Even the DSSA livery as posted by Steve1, was expensive to apply in terms of time, and masking.
The livery was heavily influenced by the then-recently introduced Southern Pacific livery of Grey and Scarlet, also known as the "bloody nose" livery for obvious reasons. However, Wallace Abbey took into account one major drawback of the Espee's scheme - in monochrome (black & white) photos, the shades of grey and red looked almost - or even absolutely - identical. See this link as an example:-
http://espee.railfan.net/nonindex/sd07_photos/5322_sp-sd7-fred_a_stindt.jpg
Spot the Red & Grey?? This'll help -
http://espee.railfan.net/nonindex/sd07_photos/2740_sp-sd07-bob_dengler.jpg

So Wallace Abbey knew he wanted the colors to contrast better. He experimented on some models in his basement. He did do a version in Grey & Red similar to the Espee's, and one in Black with Yellow, and one in White (actually - and always officially - a very light gray) and Red, and because he happened to have the color, Black with Turquoise!!! :confused:
The Light Grey(White) & Red got the vote of the Board, although there were opponents. White is, of course, a rather daft color for any form of land transport liable to getting dirty. The argument went that every greasy handprint would be visible, never mind the soot and dirt. Wallace's answer was that if you could see handprints, you were standing too close to the loco (especially if it was moving!!). His argument was that his livery was designed to be seen from miles away - and with that big "SOO" logo on the side, who could argue?
He also asked the most vociferous opponent of the white'n'red scheme, what color the man's automobile was? "White" was the rather embarrassed answer... (which Wallace already knew)
The slight sweep of the red/white join on the cabside was a deliberate attempt to give a slight sense of motion, or at least direction, to the livery. The cab side was chosen as the dividing point, as the livery had to work on many different designs of locomotive - some as yet unknown, but it was reasoned that whereas bodies might be full-width or narrow hood, grilles might be who-knows-where, and so on, they could be pretty sure that there would be an uncluttered cab side, with a window, on the loco and the divide could go there, with, in most cases, the loco number. The main exception was Switchers (as per the MP15 in the OP) where the whole cab was red. The opposite end of the loco also was painted red to balance the effect, something not easily appreciated until later when a variation was tried with a new slanted logo, the opposite end left white, and the number moved from cabside to far end of the loco just above the walkway:-
http://www.rr-fallenflags.org/soo/soo0801dsa.jpg
The disadvantages of this variation were soon apparent; the slanted logos were not of the best quality & soon wore off; the white end rather than red just made the loco look 'unfinished' next to the normal livery, and the number position was inconvenient, and often obscured altogether in the winter by build-up of snow on the walkway!! That variation was soon abandoned. One change was kept; increasing the angle of the red sweep on the cab, with a very small curve at the bottom, which became know as "hockey stick", as that's what the new line resembled.
 
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Alan

Western Thunderer
Whoops should have read the thread more carefully. I've now also googled SOO and looked at Wikipedia.
 

JasonD

Western Thunderer
Yes sorry Alan, we were having a light-hearted moment instead of the really serious stuff us N American modelle... - sorry, modelers follow here. Now as I was saying if Churchward hadn't visited the Pennsylvania RR, the GWR would still have had parallel boil... oh damn haven't switched secrecy back on.
SOO4508GP38-2.jpg SOO6011SD60.jpg
What we could do with a Weaver 4-bay covd hopp and a fine-toothed saw:
FLOX3240CovHop2-bay.jpg
SOO car made into a nICE car. Sorry Jordan, an ICE car:
ICE50430exSOOcovhop3-bay.jpg
Ahhh - memory lane. Look out it's a long road!
Jason
 

soo4513

Western Thunderer
I'd have to get an MP15AC, first.... :oops:

... and the only wrong the SOO ever did was get fully taken over by CP Rail :( :p ;)

Yeap and the purchase of the bones of the Milwaukee Road, wasn't the smartest idea either. Although I do like the Milwaukee bandits.

Colin
 

steve1

Western Thunderer
Jordan,

To my eye, that scheme doesn't work. Better, I would have thought would have been a 'swoop' at both ends, to balance it out as the locos are symmetrical, or, possibly best, just paint the cab red and the rest white.

steve
 
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