Big Train James
Western Thunderer
Tru Dat!And naturally, not everything arrives at the same time - the vital part is always the last to be delivered.
D
Big Train James's US Outline Workbench - sw1500 Kitbash
- Thread starter Big Train James
- Start date
mickoo
Western Thunderer
I don't know how I'll ever survive the duration waiting for etch to arrive from PPD!
That's easy, send loads of artwork spread out over several weeks, you'll be too busy on the second and third part to notice the delay in the first arrival, after that you'll get regular parcels and boxes to open
Big Train James
Western Thunderer
I should post some pictures...
Work continues on the front of my conversion project while I await the arrival of some 3d printed parts. I've no idea whether the printed fan parts will work, or more importantly whether they will survive the cleaning and removal of support material without breaking any of the bits. I've ordered some spares so I can try again if I break anything the first time. I sure hope they work as they will be the simplest, timeliest, most accurate way for me to create the fans.
I've created a shroud for the fan blade to sit in. Two layers of .060" styrene laminated together for starters. Then some .080" bits for spacers on the back side. The last layer will be a plain sheet which will serve two purposes. One will be to close off the interior of the shell. The second purpose will be to hold a mounting post for the fan blade to fit over. This last layer also now hosts an approximate representation of the prototype frame that holds the fan motor and bearing.
The motor mount frame will be painted in grey primer, with the rest of the sheet painted flat black. I don't know if the frame will even be visible behind the fan itself, the shutter vanes, and the mesh grill. As usual, the question is where to draw the line as far when it comes to how much detail is acceptable. But it was a simple addition requiring little effort, and will be a nice touch in the event somebody decides to inspect the finished project really closely.
I've also sliced off the front of the headlight housing in preparation for a more accurate rendition. What do they say about idle minds? The SP switcher variants had a grouping of five lights on the nose on delivery. Most of the extra lights were removed during later shoppings, with just the traditional twin beam Pyle headlight remaining. Compared to non-SP versions, the light housing is several inches deeper front to back than on standard units. I'm not totally sure how I'm going to handle the additional volume just yet. Other than to irrevocably slice apart the existing part that is
! I'm sure I will build it up, and try to graft the headlight from the old piece onto the newly built section. The class lights on the ends of the housing have been plated over. I may do plates from .005" styrene, or add them to an etch sheet. There is some fastener detail on them, so half etching might be the trick.
I will need to deal with the location of the threaded insert at the nose where the shell screws to the frame. You can see the gap in the shroud to accommodate it. I will put a piece of .005" styrene in the gap, then wrap another piece around the opening in the shroud to present a clean surface. I think at that point everything will look appropriate.
I'm still putzing away on the etch drawings. I start working on it, and then see something else I should slice off this perfectly adequate shell. Now if I could only get my fan blades delivered (hopefully tomorrow), I can proceed incrementally.
Jim
Work continues on the front of my conversion project while I await the arrival of some 3d printed parts. I've no idea whether the printed fan parts will work, or more importantly whether they will survive the cleaning and removal of support material without breaking any of the bits. I've ordered some spares so I can try again if I break anything the first time. I sure hope they work as they will be the simplest, timeliest, most accurate way for me to create the fans.
I've created a shroud for the fan blade to sit in. Two layers of .060" styrene laminated together for starters. Then some .080" bits for spacers on the back side. The last layer will be a plain sheet which will serve two purposes. One will be to close off the interior of the shell. The second purpose will be to hold a mounting post for the fan blade to fit over. This last layer also now hosts an approximate representation of the prototype frame that holds the fan motor and bearing.
The motor mount frame will be painted in grey primer, with the rest of the sheet painted flat black. I don't know if the frame will even be visible behind the fan itself, the shutter vanes, and the mesh grill. As usual, the question is where to draw the line as far when it comes to how much detail is acceptable. But it was a simple addition requiring little effort, and will be a nice touch in the event somebody decides to inspect the finished project really closely.
I've also sliced off the front of the headlight housing in preparation for a more accurate rendition. What do they say about idle minds? The SP switcher variants had a grouping of five lights on the nose on delivery. Most of the extra lights were removed during later shoppings, with just the traditional twin beam Pyle headlight remaining. Compared to non-SP versions, the light housing is several inches deeper front to back than on standard units. I'm not totally sure how I'm going to handle the additional volume just yet. Other than to irrevocably slice apart the existing part that is
! I'm sure I will build it up, and try to graft the headlight from the old piece onto the newly built section. The class lights on the ends of the housing have been plated over. I may do plates from .005" styrene, or add them to an etch sheet. There is some fastener detail on them, so half etching might be the trick. I will need to deal with the location of the threaded insert at the nose where the shell screws to the frame. You can see the gap in the shroud to accommodate it. I will put a piece of .005" styrene in the gap, then wrap another piece around the opening in the shroud to present a clean surface. I think at that point everything will look appropriate.
I'm still putzing away on the etch drawings. I start working on it, and then see something else I should slice off this perfectly adequate shell
. Now if I could only get my fan blades delivered (hopefully tomorrow), I can proceed incrementally.Jim
Big Train James
Western Thunderer
I'm shooting for this behind the shutter vanes...
Jordan
Mid-Western Thunderer
Don't ever move to the UK & still order stuff from the USA, then...!!!Arrrrgh....waiting for parts to arrive is agonizing....
I don't know how I'll ever survive the duration waiting for etch to arrive from PPD!
Big Train James
Western Thunderer
I should post some pictures...
View attachment 46905
View attachment 46906
Jim
I meant to mention that this will also afford me the opportunity to address the overly thick lip of the roof overhang without affecting the flag holders.
Jim
mickoo
Western Thunderer
Coming along nicely
Not sure what materials they use in the US for 3D printing, but if they are close to what we use over here your fan blades will be quite tough, tougher than you might think
I'm still pondering what to do with the lip over my front light bar, like the cab, if you trim the plastic back and add something finer then the light bar ends up too deep and in the wrong position. The flag holders would have to go but I'm going to get some etched up with the radiator etches, so I can stick them back if I'm so inclined.
All the best
Mick
Not sure what materials they use in the US for 3D printing, but if they are close to what we use over here your fan blades will be quite tough, tougher than you might think
I'm still pondering what to do with the lip over my front light bar, like the cab, if you trim the plastic back and add something finer then the light bar ends up too deep and in the wrong position. The flag holders would have to go but I'm going to get some etched up with the radiator etches, so I can stick them back if I'm so inclined.
All the best
Mick
Big Train James
Western Thunderer
It's well past time to revive this thread and get this project moving again. Very little has happened with this build for the past year, due to any number of reasons. Not least of which has been the matter of my mojo sneaking out the other door while I got busy with other things and wasn't paying attention. I've still been staying involved of course, but mostly via minimum effort activities like quietly observing, hitting the like button, or the occasional short post. It's time to start earning my keep again. I've had a read back through the whole thread to remind myself what I've said (and boy is it a lot - I do carry on a bit). Mind that I'm currently in a sort of temporary situation with respect to living quarters, so I have limited tools available to me and also am without decent lights and set for photography. I shall do my best.
I left off before focusing on the radiator area, including both the front facing grill and fan as well as the topside grill and radiator cores. I'll pick back up in the same area. I've worked up additional 3d modeling for the shutter vanes, circular plenum, motor/fan mounting stand, and view block. I may or may not use the 3d printing method to create a new flange for the outward face of the shell. It will depend on the quality of my first prints. I'm only truly concerned about the flange from the perspective of a convincing attachment method/rendering of the grill attachment to the flange. And the fact that I filed away a touch to much from one corner of the flange while thinning it down. I'm also reconsidering the flange in etch as part of a way to successfully attach the grill. But I'll get to that later.
The first iteration didn't account for a view block to the interior of the shell. It had a motor stand with a much deeper profile, which I would have preferred.
But it would have then been fairly impractical to form a view block around the existing frame lugs and the back of the motor stand, as the stand actually extends out in between the two lugs. I could remove the lugs, which had been my initial intention, but they should probably stay now. More on that later.
So the depth of the motor stand was conceded, and significantly reduced. A view block was integrated into what I am calling the assembly frame (the dark square wrapper in the above photo).
Not the best image as can be seen, but one can see that the motor stand is now just rendered in relief against the backing panel. In reality this is almost certainly ok, as viewing angles and lighting would have to be just so to see the legs behind the grill, shutter vanes, and fan blades. I was trying to make it perfect, which is unnecessary, but a common issue when working on the 3d model out of context from its true scale size.
Front:
Rear:
Exploded views:
The idea with the individual parts is so that anything that needs painting can be done without masking. Most liveries wouldn't even be an issue. The other benefit is that some parts can be printed in a higher resolution material (hence more expensive), while the background parts can be printed at lower cost. Not yet modeled or shown would be holes at the four corners of the assembly to screw everything together with some 2-56 (or smaller) screws. The entire assembly could be painted or weathered at any time, and disassembled if necessary.
I also explored having the fan blade cast in brass, and ultimately arranged for it to be done in white metal at lower cost, but I don't have those castings in hand yet to observe their quality, or if they even fit properly. If the white metal fans turn out well, I will almost certainly use them instead of a 3d printed version.
Another consideration was to make the shutter vanes movable. For this initial test they will remain fixed, but I could modify them to print as separate vanes and then mount them to the top and bottom plates. For my purposes, the shutters will always be 100% open. Why cover up the fan detail behind it? But the one concern I have is if a paint scheme requires painting with the shutters closed, a la the diagonal striping on the Burlington Northern version shown earlier in the thread. I would think masking and painting would be simplest with the shutters closed, then rotated open after the fact. But since I don't currently have a plan to paint anything up in the BN version, I'm not concerned with movable vanes.
I was originally going to remove the two conical lugs from the frame (these can be seen in earlier photos), but I now realize they make a perfectly good mounting point for both the fan assembly and also for a platform for speaker and decoder mounting. To that end, I've added the shelf to the back side of the view block, with the extra height above the top of the lugs accounting for the clearance over the top of the motor.
There has been discussion on some other forums I follow about the use of speaker modules from Tang Band, which include an enclosure and a passive radiator design that allows for fairly successful bass rendering. The form factor of these modules also fits well with the nature of our narrow hoods. The idea is to mount the speaker facing upward to radiate through the radiator core section, instead of utilizing the typical smaller round speaker facing downward in the fuel tank. Based on a glance at the Loksound site, I should be able to fit a proper decoder on the shelf at the end by toward the cab.
I was going to create a 3d model of an accurate radiator core for the model. I will have to modify the design so as to have an opening covered in speaker fabric, but which still aesthetically looks appropriate.
Credit for the speaker plan goes mostly to Bob Sobol of A & O Railroad fame. He was part of a conversation concerning the speaker sound quality, but placement and use of speaker fabric mimic his plans for an Atlas sw9 build. I had never considered facing the speaker upward. And I would have skipped sound entirely if I couldn't get decent quality, which would have been impossible with the OEM speaker.
That's it for the moment. I need to get everything printed from Shapeways and do a test fit. I also have reconsidered the etch for the grills and will need to ask some questions in that regard when I get to that point. I expect, and hope, now that I've gotten this "first" post out of the way, I will be more active going forward.
Cheers,
Jim
). Mind that I'm currently in a sort of temporary situation with respect to living quarters, so I have limited tools available to me and also am without decent lights and set for photography. I shall do my best.I left off before focusing on the radiator area, including both the front facing grill and fan as well as the topside grill and radiator cores. I'll pick back up in the same area. I've worked up additional 3d modeling for the shutter vanes, circular plenum, motor/fan mounting stand, and view block. I may or may not use the 3d printing method to create a new flange for the outward face of the shell. It will depend on the quality of my first prints. I'm only truly concerned about the flange from the perspective of a convincing attachment method/rendering of the grill attachment to the flange. And the fact that I filed away a touch to much from one corner of the flange while thinning it down. I'm also reconsidering the flange in etch as part of a way to successfully attach the grill. But I'll get to that later.
The first iteration didn't account for a view block to the interior of the shell. It had a motor stand with a much deeper profile, which I would have preferred.
But it would have then been fairly impractical to form a view block around the existing frame lugs and the back of the motor stand, as the stand actually extends out in between the two lugs. I could remove the lugs, which had been my initial intention, but they should probably stay now. More on that later.
So the depth of the motor stand was conceded, and significantly reduced. A view block was integrated into what I am calling the assembly frame (the dark square wrapper in the above photo).
Not the best image as can be seen, but one can see that the motor stand is now just rendered in relief against the backing panel. In reality this is almost certainly ok, as viewing angles and lighting would have to be just so to see the legs behind the grill, shutter vanes, and fan blades. I was trying to make it perfect, which is unnecessary, but a common issue when working on the 3d model out of context from its true scale size.
Front:
Rear:
Exploded views:
The idea with the individual parts is so that anything that needs painting can be done without masking. Most liveries wouldn't even be an issue. The other benefit is that some parts can be printed in a higher resolution material (hence more expensive), while the background parts can be printed at lower cost. Not yet modeled or shown would be holes at the four corners of the assembly to screw everything together with some 2-56 (or smaller) screws. The entire assembly could be painted or weathered at any time, and disassembled if necessary.
I also explored having the fan blade cast in brass, and ultimately arranged for it to be done in white metal at lower cost, but I don't have those castings in hand yet to observe their quality, or if they even fit properly. If the white metal fans turn out well, I will almost certainly use them instead of a 3d printed version.
Another consideration was to make the shutter vanes movable. For this initial test they will remain fixed, but I could modify them to print as separate vanes and then mount them to the top and bottom plates. For my purposes, the shutters will always be 100% open. Why cover up the fan detail behind it? But the one concern I have is if a paint scheme requires painting with the shutters closed, a la the diagonal striping on the Burlington Northern version shown earlier in the thread. I would think masking and painting would be simplest with the shutters closed, then rotated open after the fact. But since I don't currently have a plan to paint anything up in the BN version, I'm not concerned with movable vanes.
I was originally going to remove the two conical lugs from the frame (these can be seen in earlier photos), but I now realize they make a perfectly good mounting point for both the fan assembly and also for a platform for speaker and decoder mounting. To that end, I've added the shelf to the back side of the view block, with the extra height above the top of the lugs accounting for the clearance over the top of the motor.
There has been discussion on some other forums I follow about the use of speaker modules from Tang Band, which include an enclosure and a passive radiator design that allows for fairly successful bass rendering. The form factor of these modules also fits well with the nature of our narrow hoods. The idea is to mount the speaker facing upward to radiate through the radiator core section, instead of utilizing the typical smaller round speaker facing downward in the fuel tank. Based on a glance at the Loksound site, I should be able to fit a proper decoder on the shelf at the end by toward the cab.
I was going to create a 3d model of an accurate radiator core for the model. I will have to modify the design so as to have an opening covered in speaker fabric, but which still aesthetically looks appropriate.
Credit for the speaker plan goes mostly to Bob Sobol of A & O Railroad fame. He was part of a conversation concerning the speaker sound quality, but placement and use of speaker fabric mimic his plans for an Atlas sw9 build. I had never considered facing the speaker upward. And I would have skipped sound entirely if I couldn't get decent quality, which would have been impossible with the OEM speaker.
That's it for the moment. I need to get everything printed from Shapeways and do a test fit. I also have reconsidered the etch for the grills and will need to ask some questions in that regard when I get to that point. I expect, and hope, now that I've gotten this "first" post out of the way, I will be more active going forward.
Cheers,
Jim
Yorkshire Dave
Western Thunderer
I've always face speakers downwards in the loco body. Where I can I build the sound chamber into the long hood and this was successful when I was modelling Canadian HO. In my SSW GP9 I'll be making up separate sound chamber, however the speaker will still face downwards.
I never install speakers in the fuel tank as it could pick up any magnetic debris left in the track.
Big Train James
Western Thunderer
Most everybody seems to face the speakers down, historically. Something to do with bouncing the sound off the roadbed. I also presumed it happened because for many locos, the fuel tank was the widest place on the engine besides the cab, and could also be perforated on the bottom without affecting aesthetics.
But is there really any reason not to face the speakers upward? I had figured that as long as there were openings to allow the sound out, it might not matter which way the speaker faces (all other things, like enclosures, being equal). I have seen an example or two where modelers have used the sugar cube speakers mounted to the inside of the roof of the long hood, facing upward through the radiator and dynamic brake fan openings.
For me to bother with sound, it has to be really convincing. I wouldn't even have bothered with a traditional speaker on this model as the current one is already lacking and there will be even less space in the fuel tank once it is shortened by a half inch or so. The configuration and performance of the cited Tang Band speakers will fit well within the carbody, even for hood units like this. I'm going to give it a go, at least once.
Jim
But is there really any reason not to face the speakers upward? I had figured that as long as there were openings to allow the sound out, it might not matter which way the speaker faces (all other things, like enclosures, being equal). I have seen an example or two where modelers have used the sugar cube speakers mounted to the inside of the roof of the long hood, facing upward through the radiator and dynamic brake fan openings.
For me to bother with sound, it has to be really convincing. I wouldn't even have bothered with a traditional speaker on this model as the current one is already lacking and there will be even less space in the fuel tank once it is shortened by a half inch or so. The configuration and performance of the cited Tang Band speakers will fit well within the carbody, even for hood units like this. I'm going to give it a go, at least once.
Jim
Big Train James
Western Thunderer
I've gotten my first prints back from Shapeways. I'm generally satisfied with everything, but I will need to make some adjustments to the parts to account for robustness and ease of assembly before I print other copies. Let's see some pictures.
There are four components in the radiator fan assembly. Shutters, fan blade, plenum, and backing piece with mounting pin and motor stand "legs" in relief. I printed the shutters and fan blade together, and the plenum and backing together, to save half on the $5.00 per part handling fee. The first pictures show the parts as printed, connected by sprues.
Now separated, with the aid of some flush cutting sprue nippers. First is the shutter assembly, with vanes and mounting flanges. I've already broken off the first vane, without even trying. Hopefully some CA will make it right again.
Next are the blade, plenum (already inserted, I couldn't help myself
) and backing piece. The plenum is the circular insert with the gaps at the four corners.
And mocked into the nose of the shell. I've kept the shutters separate for now for fear of breaking them all.
Final result will be something like this.
The tabs on the rear of the shutter assembly are supposed to slide into the gaps at the corners of the plenum piece, but the fit is too snug at the moment. Taking a file to the parts, especially the shutter assembly, will possibly damage them. I'll give it a try, but I have low expectations. I can always glue, and I know I will be printing at least another copy or two in the near future.
The full assembly of four parts can be screwed together by tapping the holes located in each corner. This is so parts can be disassembled if needed for painting or weathering. Once assembled, the whole thing will fit into the radiator opening as shown in the last picture. A new etched metal grill will cover it all, but that's another project. I mentioned in my last post about the possibility of making the shutters able to rotate. That may require a hybrid approach, with a wire pin at top and bottom to replace the printed nub that connects the vanes to the flanges. I don't think the plastic can handle the movement. But again, I'll cross that bridge when I come to it.
I printed some other parts at the same time. One is a set of replacement gear box covers for the Atlas sw8/9 switcher trucks that I will be using. The originals show a tendency to tear out at the corners where the attachment screws are located. The OEM screws are flat heads, countersunk into the cover. I presume that overzealous tightening of the screws puts some lateral force on the plastic, which splits it out. Countersinking the hole also removes quite a bit of material so that may contribute to the problem as well.
These covers are printed in the flexible plastic material instead of the Frosted Extreme Detail used for the radiator parts. I wasn't concerned with the finish aesthetic as the part won't be seen. As can be seen indicated on the cover, these covers are intended for a P48 application, with the side frame mounting tabs and corresponding holes moved significantly closer to the centerline of the truck. This relocation will bring the brake rigging over the center of the wheel tread. The side frames are designed to accommodate the 3-rail market with its huge wheels, so the brakes hang out over nothing when wheelsets are substituted.
3-Rail versus P48 (.115" tread width plus 4'-8 1/2" gauge)
3-Rail versus 2-rail (.145" tread width and 5'-0" gauge)
These are in the works in brass and in regular 5'-0" gauge 2-rail as well, but I got impatient and had some printed. The material is a bit too flexible where the side frames attach. Brass will be better. These are also designed with pan head screws instead of the countersunk flat heads so that the only stress on the plastic is the clamping pressure. The brass versions are countersunk, and can utilize the original screws.
Last up are some rungs for end and side ladders for my long dormant TBOX project. This was largely a test to see what was possible with the Frosted Extreme Detail material. They look decent, even though you'll have to take my word for it. My phone can't manage anything better for photos. For scale reference, the fan blade is 1 1/8" diameter across opposite blade tips. The rungs are drawn at a scale 3/4" diameter. They are modeled to have the proper forged shape at the ends and include the rivet detail on front and back. With my visor, I can just make out the shapes at the ends of the rungs.
They will theoretically attach to etched metal stiles to form the ladders. I may explore having them cast in brass for strength, considering what I've already learned with the shutters. Either way, I'll need some stronger magnification to work with them.
Currently in the queue is a bunch of cad work. I need to finalize etch for the front and top grills, work up a model for the radiator core, and I'm currently working on a 3d model of the flexicoil trucks used on the sw1500's.
Even with the modified gear box covers that realign the brake shoes, there is still a tremendous gap between the wheel face and back of sideframe due to the tread widths. The sideframe itself is too thin, again to accommodate the 3-rail wheels. I was going to back it with some styrene and file to match. But as I got to looking at the Atlas sideframes, I concluded that they are rather poorly rendered compared to the prototype. The general form is there, but the details are wrong. So of course I'm going to model some of my own, and either have them printed for direct use, or printed to use as masters to cast.
I've just stumbled on a resource for EMD loco data the other night that is pure gold for technical information and technical drawings of components including essentially every EMD truck style including Blombergs and HTC-1's. I'm talking about plans, sections, elevations, and break-outs for brake system rigging, in pdf format that can be inserted into cad, scaled, and traced. I've been looking for data on the HTC trucks for years, in fact it's how I ended up here in the first place, with a mention in Mick's US modeling thread.
RR-Fallenflags.org
Fallen Flags locomotive manuals page
Go the EMD master parts catalogs on the Manuals page and get lost for a while. It's mind blowing how much information is available there. There's also material for other loco manufacturers as well. But right now all I have time to worry about is EMD. Be forewarned though...it's a deep rabbit hole.
Here's a sample for the EMD Flexicoil 2 axle truck I'm working on now.
That's all I've got for now. Hopefully that's enough! I have family business to deal with through the end of the weekend, so little is likely to happen between then and now. But I will have my laptop with me, and source files, and can work on cad if I have free time.
Cheers,
Jim
There are four components in the radiator fan assembly. Shutters, fan blade, plenum, and backing piece with mounting pin and motor stand "legs" in relief. I printed the shutters and fan blade together, and the plenum and backing together, to save half on the $5.00 per part handling fee. The first pictures show the parts as printed, connected by sprues.
Now separated, with the aid of some flush cutting sprue nippers. First is the shutter assembly, with vanes and mounting flanges. I've already broken off the first vane, without even trying.
Hopefully some CA will make it right again.Next are the blade, plenum (already inserted, I couldn't help myself
) and backing piece. The plenum is the circular insert with the gaps at the four corners.And mocked into the nose of the shell. I've kept the shutters separate for now for fear of breaking them all.
Final result will be something like this.
The tabs on the rear of the shutter assembly are supposed to slide into the gaps at the corners of the plenum piece, but the fit is too snug at the moment. Taking a file to the parts, especially the shutter assembly, will possibly damage them. I'll give it a try, but I have low expectations. I can always glue, and I know I will be printing at least another copy or two in the near future.
The full assembly of four parts can be screwed together by tapping the holes located in each corner. This is so parts can be disassembled if needed for painting or weathering. Once assembled, the whole thing will fit into the radiator opening as shown in the last picture. A new etched metal grill will cover it all, but that's another project. I mentioned in my last post about the possibility of making the shutters able to rotate. That may require a hybrid approach, with a wire pin at top and bottom to replace the printed nub that connects the vanes to the flanges. I don't think the plastic can handle the movement. But again, I'll cross that bridge when I come to it.
I printed some other parts at the same time. One is a set of replacement gear box covers for the Atlas sw8/9 switcher trucks that I will be using. The originals show a tendency to tear out at the corners where the attachment screws are located. The OEM screws are flat heads, countersunk into the cover. I presume that overzealous tightening of the screws puts some lateral force on the plastic, which splits it out. Countersinking the hole also removes quite a bit of material so that may contribute to the problem as well.
These covers are printed in the flexible plastic material instead of the Frosted Extreme Detail used for the radiator parts. I wasn't concerned with the finish aesthetic as the part won't be seen. As can be seen indicated on the cover, these covers are intended for a P48 application, with the side frame mounting tabs and corresponding holes moved significantly closer to the centerline of the truck. This relocation will bring the brake rigging over the center of the wheel tread. The side frames are designed to accommodate the 3-rail market with its huge wheels, so the brakes hang out over nothing when wheelsets are substituted.
3-Rail versus P48 (.115" tread width plus 4'-8 1/2" gauge)
3-Rail versus 2-rail (.145" tread width and 5'-0" gauge)
These are in the works in brass and in regular 5'-0" gauge 2-rail as well, but I got impatient and had some printed. The material is a bit too flexible where the side frames attach. Brass will be better. These are also designed with pan head screws instead of the countersunk flat heads so that the only stress on the plastic is the clamping pressure. The brass versions are countersunk, and can utilize the original screws.
Last up are some rungs for end and side ladders for my long dormant TBOX project. This was largely a test to see what was possible with the Frosted Extreme Detail material. They look decent, even though you'll have to take my word for it. My phone can't manage anything better for photos. For scale reference, the fan blade is 1 1/8" diameter across opposite blade tips. The rungs are drawn at a scale 3/4" diameter. They are modeled to have the proper forged shape at the ends and include the rivet detail on front and back. With my visor, I can just make out the shapes at the ends of the rungs.
They will theoretically attach to etched metal stiles to form the ladders. I may explore having them cast in brass for strength, considering what I've already learned with the shutters. Either way, I'll need some stronger magnification to work with them.
Currently in the queue is a bunch of cad work. I need to finalize etch for the front and top grills, work up a model for the radiator core, and I'm currently working on a 3d model of the flexicoil trucks used on the sw1500's.
Even with the modified gear box covers that realign the brake shoes, there is still a tremendous gap between the wheel face and back of sideframe due to the tread widths. The sideframe itself is too thin, again to accommodate the 3-rail wheels. I was going to back it with some styrene and file to match. But as I got to looking at the Atlas sideframes, I concluded that they are rather poorly rendered compared to the prototype. The general form is there, but the details are wrong. So of course I'm going to model some of my own, and either have them printed for direct use, or printed to use as masters to cast.
I've just stumbled on a resource for EMD loco data the other night that is pure gold for technical information and technical drawings of components including essentially every EMD truck style including Blombergs and HTC-1's. I'm talking about plans, sections, elevations, and break-outs for brake system rigging, in pdf format that can be inserted into cad, scaled, and traced. I've been looking for data on the HTC trucks for years, in fact it's how I ended up here in the first place, with a mention in Mick's US modeling thread.
RR-Fallenflags.org
Fallen Flags locomotive manuals page
Go the EMD master parts catalogs on the Manuals page and get lost for a while. It's mind blowing how much information is available there. There's also material for other loco manufacturers as well. But right now all I have time to worry about is EMD. Be forewarned though...it's a deep rabbit hole.
Here's a sample for the EMD Flexicoil 2 axle truck I'm working on now.
That's all I've got for now. Hopefully that's enough!
I have family business to deal with through the end of the weekend, so little is likely to happen between then and now. But I will have my laptop with me, and source files, and can work on cad if I have free time.Cheers,
Jim
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Jordan
Mid-Western Thunderer
Took me a while to work that out!!
there are times I really hate the 3-rail legacy that often shows up even on 2-rail models 
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Big Train James
Western Thunderer
Absolutely. The two motor design is all about fitting 3-rail electronics and smoke units inside. But the front motor by default resides in the cab and is both hideous and prevents detailing. Gearbox and truck design is predicated on mounting motors vertically to each truck, but there isn't enough room for a proper flywheel or reduction gearing. And pilots and frames are designed to allow clearance for the huge flanges with exaggerated swings due to tight radii. Even rolling stock is affected, with ride height increased and underframe detail left out to again accommodate the flanges.
I'm okay with the Atlas switcher drives because they are single motor and work properly. But for anything else, I've conceded that I will need to build my own drive. But that's okay too, because I would want to build my own frame anyway.
And most of all, recently I've gotten more realistic about how much modeling I will ever be able to afford, from a time and space and behavioral perspective. I have a tendency to get things part way done. The net result is that, if honest, I would admit that I will never have more than a handful of locomotives that meet my personal tastes and standards (and I've long since realized that a giant model railroad empire isn't happening either). So the extra effort to build drives and frames should be feasible and ultimately attainable. I reserve the right to change my mind if I happen to win the lotto someday.
My new goal is simply to make progress on something, even if it is an incremental step that takes a while to achieve.
The two motor design is all about fitting 3-rail electronics and smoke units inside. But the front motor by default resides in the cab and is both hideous and prevents detailing. Gearbox and truck design is predicated on mounting motors vertically to each truck, but there isn't enough room for a proper flywheel or reduction gearing. And pilots and frames are designed to allow clearance for the huge flanges with exaggerated swings due to tight radii. Even rolling stock is affected, with ride height increased and underframe detail left out to again accommodate the flanges.I'm okay with the Atlas switcher drives because they are single motor and work properly. But for anything else, I've conceded that I will need to build my own drive. But that's okay too, because I would want to build my own frame anyway.
And most of all, recently I've gotten more realistic about how much modeling I will ever be able to afford, from a time and space and behavioral perspective. I have a tendency to get things part way done. The net result is that, if honest, I would admit that I will never have more than a handful of locomotives that meet my personal tastes and standards (and I've long since realized that a giant model railroad empire isn't happening either). So the extra effort to build drives and frames should be feasible and ultimately attainable. I reserve the right to change my mind if I happen to win the lotto someday.
My new goal is simply to make progress on something, even if it is an incremental step that takes a while to achieve.
Yorkshire Dave
Western Thunderer
This is what occurred with the Red Caboose GP9 frames except it was for 2-rail 0.145" tread, 5'-0" gauge. The trucks are scale width but they took a chunk out the frame where the wheels are to accommodate the 0.145 tread. I made a filler pattern for a silicon mould and cast them in resin.
Dangerous sites these
- I've already copied the GP9 pages..... now for the U23B AKA pizza cutters.
Jordan
Mid-Western Thunderer
Pizza cutters?? Surely they're too blunt for that even?
Steamroller treads, more like!!!
Jim, with you all the way on the "what I can realisticly acheive in one lifetime" thing. It's why I'm not going down the P48 route; I simply don't have the time, especially since taking a big plunge (& total career change) into Self Employment!
Steamroller treads, more like!!!
Jim, with you all the way on the "what I can realisticly acheive in one lifetime" thing. It's why I'm not going down the P48 route; I simply don't have the time, especially since taking a big plunge (& total career change) into Self Employment!
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Pugsley
Western Thunderer
You ain't kidding! What a resource. I've just been educating myself about the SD40 electrical system, when I really should be doing something else. You see, I have a theory on why you quite often hear EMD units surging at the top end, but haven't, as yet, found anything to confirm it.Be forewarned though...it's a deep rabbit hole.
Bookmarked for later - I may be gone some time....
Pugsley
Western Thunderer
Congratulations! I did the same thing back in February this year and it's been the best thing I've ever done. I wish you every success with it - I bet you won't miss the transport industry, I don't.
Jordan
Mid-Western Thunderer
I miss actually driving the big 'uns, but not all the hassle that goes with the job, no!!
mickoo
Western Thunderer
I think that's the translation step from full field to weak field, though I think by the time EMD got to the SD40 and 645 engine block it was near absent. It's certainly very present on the previous generation 567 engines like GP9 and SD9 as well as all the Euro derivatives in Denmark, Belgium and Luxembourg. It is that single characteristic of the engine unloading at translation that l love the most about EMD engines as well as that lovely whine the SNCB class 55 and 62 have from their fans. I think I've just decided what my next therapy project isYou ain't kidding! What a resource. I've just been educating myself about the SD40 electrical system, when I really should be doing something else. You see, I have a theory on why you quite often hear EMD units surging at the top end, but haven't, as yet, found anything to confirm it.
Bookmarked for later - I may be gone some time....