David Andrews 7mm Stanier 2 6 4 tank.

Discussion in 'Area 51' started by P A D, 9 February 2019.

  1. dibateg

    dibateg Western Thunderer

    Lovely tidy work Peter - and great progress, have you actually had any sleep at all!

    cmax and John57sharp like this.
  2. P A D

    P A D Western Thunderer

    Many thanks Tony.

    I'm retiring at the end of the month so work is winding down and I'm getting more slots during the day when I can do some fettling.

    Truth be told it's a very easy kit to build and very simple construction compared to the MOK 4MT tank. The cab and tank sides are made from only 3 pieces and having deviated from the instruction sequence, I've got most of the body done before completing the chassis. It looks further on than it is.

    It pays to add as much detail as you can earlier than later, so I'll be decorating the tank tops as much as possible before the boiler goes in. Hardest bit so far has been filing and drilling the tank front oil boxes. They look like they were on steroids as they come.

    BR Tony, Pencarrow, 3 LINK and 3 others like this.
  3. Rob Pulham

    Rob Pulham Western Thunderer

    You lucky man Peter, I have been trying to go early retirement since last October but they haven't agreed to let me go yet.:(
  4. P A D

    P A D Western Thunderer

    Hi Rob,
    I'm 65 so not going early, but good luck with your efforts to join me.:)
    Rob Pulham likes this.
  5. Focalplane

    Focalplane Western Thunderer

    I waited until 69 and regret the delay. 4 years later I can’t remember much about the working life.

    The funny thing is I seem to be busier now than when working.

    SimonME30 likes this.
  6. Rob Pulham

    Rob Pulham Western Thunderer

    Hi Peter,

    You must have had a smaller paper round than me because I would have sworn you were at least 10 years younger than that.:thumbs:
    P A D likes this.
  7. Genghis

    Genghis Western Thunderer

    Me too!
    P A D and Rob Pulham like this.
  8. simond

    simond Western Thunderer

    61, 5 years to go, having fun, not in a hurry...
  9. parky

    parky Western Thunderer

    59 and 3 years to go, unless a deal is offered to go earlier :)
    Rob Pulham likes this.
  10. LarryG

    LarryG Western Thunderer

    Retirement...What's that? I'm now much older than both my granddads and even older than my dad now. If they could come down for an hour, one granddad would be asking how WW2 ended while the other would be wondering if we had all lost our marbles. My dad would be counting the number of boarded up pubs!
    BR Tony, Deano747, dibateg and 3 others like this.
  11. P A D

    P A D Western Thunderer

    Never had a paper round. My dad did send me up chimneys thought.

    Back on the build I have been deviating again. If you check out Roger Scanlon's build, he mentions that there were problems fitting the cab and the bunker floors. Rather than follow the instructions, I decided to build back from the cab front plate, getting the floor in before adding the bunker front bulhead. After making up the cab tanks two issues came to light. First the cab tanks are about 4mm wider than the rear of the main tanks.

    That means that you cannot fit the cast back plate between them.

    Two options - cut back the tanks or make cut outs in the back plate to a,low it to fit between. I chose the former which creates another problem, as the footplate is then too narrow. Note also in the image above, how the rear foot plate support covers the inner locating slots for the bunker front bulhead. To get around this I cut down the support.

    With the support cut down the slots are then accessible.

    The bulk head parts will then fit in place.

    To fill the gaps in the foot plate and cover the rear driving wheels, I made some simple splashers from spare fret. Next, the bunker floor and another problem. The supports are way too long to fit behind the the front bulhead.

    So further butchery is in order.

    But then another problem. The front extension on the bunker floor is too wide by about 1mm to fit between the bulkheads.

    After filing about 0.5mm off each side it fits. Later it came to light that the floor is too wide either side of the bend but it was soldered in place by then so filing in-situe was needed. After decorating the rear bulhead (steps, lamp irons etc.), this was fitted in place followed by the side plates.

    Here's the rear bulkhead.

    The back plate placed on the footplate. Later I'll add a bottom plate to the casting and drill and tap it to allow for fitting and removal for painting.

    Next the cab rear. I found that the etching was too wide to fit between the cab sides. I could have filed the ends but that would have left the window open ings too narrow at the outer edges. Therefore, I scored the etch down the centre, snapped it in two, then carefully filed the inner edges until it fit.

    Before fitting to the cab, I added the locker and base plates for the pick up domes. Far easier to clean up on the bench than in the cab afterwards.

    Before fitting the cab rear, I added the coal doors and hand brake support to the bulkhead.

    I'm up to 15 images so will have to split the post.

    Last edited: 12 March 2019
    BR Tony, Scanlon, Deano747 and 15 others like this.
  12. P A D

    P A D Western Thunderer

    Here's another view of the cab rear.

    This will be an LMS built loco so has the "creased" upper bunker sides. The lower slope was added first, then the upper side. There are locating slots for both in the cab rear which makes fitting them easier. At this stage they are only tacked in place until I suss out the beading. I think I'll use half round brass rather then the flat etchings in the kit.

    The seams between the lower and upper parts have yet to be soldered.

    And a preview on the chassis with the rolled roof placed on the cab. Some filling of gaps at the slot and tabs is in order along the running plate.

    Once I overcame the errors with the internal parts, the outer parts went together no bother. It's starting to look like one of Staniers big tanks now.

    Last edited: 12 March 2019
    BR Tony, SimonME30, Genghis and 22 others like this.
  13. Focalplane

    Focalplane Western Thunderer

    Wow, excellent!

  14. LarryG

    LarryG Western Thunderer

    I have always seen etched 'kits' as scratchbuilder aids, but a pal of mine who was a top scratchbuilder wouldn't have anything to do with them for years saying he wasn't clever enough to build kits! Your work on building and altering the mistakes is very impressive because you follow a path that ensures faults are discovered before it is too late.
  15. cmax

    cmax Western Thunderer

    Stunning work Peter, another masterclass!!

  16. P A D

    P A D Western Thunderer

    Thanks Larry and Gary.

    To be fair I had the heads up on the faults from Roger Scanlon's build so that makes a difference. On the cab tanks, I'd soldered them up before spotting how wide they were, so had to mark them and then cut with the piercing saw. Not too difficult but would be easier to do in the flat, scribing with the scrawker then snapping off the excess .

    First thing I do when considering a kit is to find any builds on line by other builders. No matter how good or bad the build, you can always learn something to build yours better.

    2mm Dabbler, BR Tony, Genghis and 7 others like this.
  17. P A D

    P A D Western Thunderer

    I ought to be posting this on "What's on your workbench?" as it's nothing to do with the Stanier 2 6 4. The answer is this.

    For years I've been getting by with cheapo crappy vices with either poorly aligned or wobbly jaws, and/or jaws that do not move easily and smoothly. Recently I bought a Stanley clamp on swivel vice from B&Q, which for £18 is quite good quality and large enough for use on DIY jobs around the house. For a lot of modelling jobs it is also quite useful, having smooth running jaws with horizontal and vertical V grooves for holding round work pieces. It's great for holding larger etchings for decusping and other large parts. However, for small precision jobs it comes up short.

    First, having a swivel ball joing mechanism on the clamp, it stands too high from the bench. Second, the jaws whilst smooth running, have too much slop and need careful closing and lining up for smaller mare prescise clamping jobs. Filing the oil pots for the tank fronts was a point in question.

    I had been considering this cheaper (possibly made in India or China) copy of the Bergeon 2021 watchmakers bench vice for a while. It is available from Eileen's Shestos and possibly Squires, for just over £80. I don't know if postage is on top of that. A Bergeon will set you back around £300, so £80 is a hell of a saving. That said, £80 is still a lot of money for a small bench vice so despite having seen the vice at shows and been impressed, I decided to pass.

    However, I recently found a couple of horology supplies company on the web, both offering the same vice for just under £60 including VAT.
    This is still a lot of money for a small vice, but considering that I will soon be retiring and be spending more time at the bench, I took the plunge and ordered one from Cousins UK. The other supplier I found is Cooksongold, whoes price was slightly higher. So with VAT and postage it came to £64.

    The vice comes with a quick release clamp, that allows quick and easy removal/fitting to the screwed down base plate. If you have a more substantial bench top than mine, you could chisel a recess into it, so that the plate is flush when the vice is not being used. Cousins offer spare plates for £27 excluding VAT and postage, for those who wish to use it in more than one location. Spare jaws are not mentioned.

    The jaws are well machined and perfectly parallel. The upper clamp runs in machined dovetailed slides in the base and runs very smoothly with not a hint of side to side movement or slop. Like the Bergeon, the screw is very cleverly concealed in a sheath, so not prone to filings and other gubbins, although the detritus from the workpiece can fall on the slides (as it can on the Bergeon), so only time will tell if this will be an issue.

    One further point of note, is that the removable jaws are held via recessed Allen bolts as opposed to slotted screws on the Bergeon and if you look closely on the Cousins and Cooksongold websites, the ones they illustrate are the same.

    Here is a link to the Cousins web page.
    Screw Down - 1¾" (45mm) Jaw, Watchmakers

    I probably won't get any work done at the next session as I'll just be sitting there twiddling the Tommy bar and watching the jaws move slowly back and forth. Sad I know.

    It would be interesting to know if any other modellers have had one of these vices for a while and how they have found it in use. I think I have seen one in use on one of the builds on here, possibly on one of Mickoo's threads.

    2mm Dabbler, BR Tony, PeteB and 6 others like this.
  18. mickoo

    mickoo Western Thunderer

    Worth every single penny, bought mine years ago when I saw Steves one.

    Mine is getting really worn now and I'm tempted to get a new one, two are always handy to have.

    I'd love something of the same quality but maybe twice as large, for holding footplates or frame sides a bit better.
    BR Tony likes this.
  19. John57sharp

    John57sharp Western Thunderer

    They are very good, particularly popular amongst the 2mm fraternity I believe!

  20. P A D

    P A D Western Thunderer

    Ah, so my memory served me well. Is yours the Bergeon one or the copy?

    No wonder, you could hold a whole loco in it in that scale.
    BR Tony likes this.