Gladiator 7mm GCR 11F 4-4-0

Discussion in 'Area 51' started by P A D, 18 September 2019.

  1. Stirling O

    Stirling O Active Member

    Sorry, but I can't agree that the difference between Scale 7 and O-MF is indistinguishable. Compare photographs of Scale7 and O-MF point-work and I think the difference is glaringly obvious, as evidenced by the gap between stock rails and check rails and between the stock rails and the toes of switch blades.

    Please don't think I'm being contentious, I'm just offering another point of view.

    ChrisBr and Ian@StEnochs like this.
  2. P A D

    P A D Western Thunderer

    Most of today's session was spent scraping and scrubbing excess solder from the various seams and finishing off the firebox shoulders so the boiler could be soldered to it.


    More scraping could be done inside the splashers but it's awkward to get at and you have to draw the line somewhere. As JB mentioned, the window beading was on the heavy side so I have thinned it down.

    Here's the boiler and firebox after soldering. Cleats have been added to the top of the firebox and under the boiler for the bands, which will be represented by the lining only.


    Not a lot to show for today's efforts but I think the hard bits are done now.

    Here's a shot with the smokebox door in place. It's not fixed yet as the casting is quite "porous" and will need some filling to make it smooth.

    And a quick trial fit of the reversing mechanism cover. When epoxied in place it should not interfere with the fitting and removal of the firebox.

  3. Focalplane

    Focalplane Western Thunderer

    P A D likes this.
  4. adrian

    adrian Flying Squad

    That's not quite what I said though - I was careful to preface it with "almost" indistinguishable and for a significant majority I believe that to be the case. What may be obvious to yourself as you've studied it in detail will be a subtle difference to many others.
    I agree if you compare photos side by side then the difference would be obvious IMHO because you have the comparison to make. However if you just had one piece of point-work to look at without a comparison then many would struggle to identify well built O-MF vs Scale7.
    Len Cattley, 3 LINK, simond and 5 others like this.
  5. Stirling O

    Stirling O Active Member

    Hi Larry,

    Might I enquire where you got the D11 G.A. drawing from, as I've done a search of the NRM drawing lists but have been unable to locate a G.A. drawing of the D11. Any help or pointers as to where I might acquire such a drawing would be most appreciated.

  6. LarryG

    LarryG Western Thunderer

    PM sent.
  7. Stirling O

    Stirling O Active Member

    Thanks Larry,

    PM received.

  8. P A D

    P A D Western Thunderer

    Slow progress again today with lots off fettling to get the cab splashes to fit to my satisfaction. When assembled they were too narrow to cover the slots in the upper footplate, this despite adding the sides to the outer edges of the top. To get around this I made additional sides from brass sheet and laminated them to either side of the splashers. Having got a nice fit I found the outer extension pieces were too wide and needed about 2mm removed for them to fit. I soldered these to the main splashers before fitting them into the cab as a unit. There is also a footstep on the right hand splasher and this was also added before fitting the splasher into the cab. The instructions don't mention fitting the step until later on, but fortunately I had read David Hill's build on RMWeb so thought it better so do it outside the cab.

    Here's a shot with the blackhead placed in the cab. I'll have to replace the 6BA firebox fixing screw with some counter sunk 10BAs, as the back head is just a flat slab with no space for the larger screw head.

    The roof on the other hand went together without issues although the groove for locating the ribs needed widening. The first three ribs require filing either side to taper them down to the rain strips, which are yet to be fitted.
    Hopefully the backhead can be located with the roof on, but I'll check that when it's complete, before soldering the roof in place. I think David mentioned that it could be got in on his build.

  9. P A D

    P A D Western Thunderer

    By the way, if anyone has a photo of a D10 or D11 back head, it would be useful to see it. Even the back head in the preserved Butler Henderson or a similar GCR loco would be helpful.

    Many thanks,
  10. Mike Trice

    Mike Trice Western Thunderer

  11. P A D

    P A D Western Thunderer


    Many thanks Mike.
  12. P A D

    P A D Western Thunderer

    The cab front plate and firebox back have now been modified to accept 10BA screws to fix them together. First the firebox back was thickened up with an extra layer of brass plate soldered on the inside. The holes in the cab front plate were then drilled to clear 10 BA and then with the firebox in place, the holes for tapping were marked. I cocked up the position for the upper hole and had to redo it. After drilling the holes in the back of the firebox, they were then tapped 10BA to accept the fixing screws. I much prefer doing it this way than soldering nuts in place as it is far more robust .

    The cab roof has also been completed with the addition of the rain strips. 20191008_183933.jpg

    Moving back to the boiler, the smoke box door casting was fettled up. Here's how it started out. 20191003_202709.jpg

    Rubbing it down avoiding the rivets was tiresome, so I marked their positions with a point and rubbed them off. After the door was smooth enough I drilled holes for the rivets and and replaced them with items from Prime Miniatures. After fitting the handrail, I found it was sloping so the hole for the pillar opposite the hinge was elongated to move it upwards. I need to add a little filler to disguise it. The rivets, door handle and hand rail pillars were all super glued on the inside, so no cleaning up was required.

    Here's the inside of the door casting. I decided to make if removable by making a simple " bayonet" fitting by cutting two slots opposite each other, top and bottom and then splaying out the sections between the cuts. One of them showed signs of cracking so this was repaired with solder.

    On the smoke box front ring, two slots were filed at 3 and 9 o'clock. The door is then slotted in and twisted 90 degrees to lock it in place. This will allow the owner access for fitting steam sound if desired.

    Finally, the chimney and dome have been epoxied in place. In this image, the door casting has been twisted too much so the handrail is not level.

    The semi cured epoxy that oozed out from under the castings has been scraped away, but further tidying up will be done later.

    Starting to look the part with the furniture on.

    Last edited: 9 October 2019
  13. Scale7JB

    Scale7JB Western Thunderer

    Looking very smart, Peter.

  14. Genghis

    Genghis Western Thunderer

    Sorry about the smokebox door: that one should have gone back in the melting pot.

    I recently changed the casting alloy for one that is better able to produce small parts but I have found it isn't so good for larger flat castings. Mrs Gladiator has given permission to procure another melting pot so I will have a choice of alloys. Hopefully will reduce wastage and improve quality.
  15. P A D

    P A D Western Thunderer

    Thanks JB.

    No worries David. As I said earlier, you have done well to keep the range alive and juggle your day job in Thailand. Think of the fun you'll have updating all the kits when you have more time.

    The chimney and dome needed a bit of fettling as well, but nothing untoward. The fit of both onto the smokebox and boiler was excellent which is often not the case.

    Deano747, BR Tony and Rob Pulham like this.
  16. Mike Trice

    Mike Trice Western Thunderer

  17. P A D

    P A D Western Thunderer

    Fantastic Mike! Many thanks.

    Cleaned up the remaining epoxy this afternoon with the scratch brush.

    And added the reversing lever cover to the top of the right hand splasher. Prototype photos show that it was right above the edge of the splasher so it was padded out on the inside with a strip of plastic card super glued to the casting. It is epoxied to the splasher and cab front and remains in place when the firebox and boiler are removed.

    And the roof after a bit more attention from the scraper and scratch brush. It just tacked with a tiny drop of super glue at the front and sides.


    I decide to have a break from the loco and made a start on the tender. The valances, front and rear beams a d fixing nuts have all been added to the running plate. 20191010_192941.jpg

    The rear plate has been tacked in place and a start made on prepping the sides and flares. I've added some waste fret strips over the grab rail holes on the rear plate and the rails will be just push fit until after painting. The extra layer will give some purchase to the rails when they are glued in place. I'll make up the central hand rail in the pillars, but again will leave it loose for final fixing after painting as the rear will be lined out. I wonder if the lamp irons will be in the way of the lining???

    I was going to start on the chassis but found that one of the side frames was missing. Apparently this is separate from the main etch and was missed at packing. An e-mail to David Hill received a swift response and he will send me the missing part. Just as well really, as the instructions mention that the chassis frames may need some filing to fit and this can now be sorted out before the chassis is assembled.

    Rob Pulham, Scanlon, LarryG and 3 others like this.
  18. warren haywood

    warren haywood Western Thunderer

    Yes, the rear lamp irons probably will be :(
  19. P A D

    P A D Western Thunderer

    So they need to be pinned for pushing into a hole after lining. :thumbs:
  20. warren haywood

    warren haywood Western Thunderer

    If you can:)