Mickoos European dabblings

mickoo

Western Thunderer
Blimey, you must have a cacophony of interest bubbles in orbit at the moment:)

Put me down for one when you produce a kit/etchings.....whatever it is:)

Richard
Bloody rabbit holes I tell you!

I've been struggling to get good information on Danish locos, it's not a thriving scene over there like Germany and the UK and technical info is very very thin on the ground with books that have prices that make KISS engines look decidedly cheap.

So to find this this afternoon is amazing.
DSB litra E Tekniske data, oversigter, tegninger

Check out the drawings at the bottom, more than enough to make some thing that resembles an E class :thumbs:

Interests, afraid so :p I've never let the Euro bubble really free as it's a wicked beast to contain and I'm only just scratching the DB side of things in a vain attempt to keep some sort of cohesion to it all.

Etchings, one good thing with the Germans is a high degree of standardization, I use the term loosely when talking about the Br.50 class mind! Many fittings are common so it helps with the art work and parts process. The biggest hurdle is wheels, getting good wheels is a bit of a chore, though Mark Wood does some nice BR.50 wheel sets, at a price mind, I've not looked at other classes but the tender, pony and bogie wheels might be the same as the Br.50.

It's no point considering a project if you cannot get all the parts, though you can get them abroad but they are typically very pricey.

Wilgro do a nice range of wheels, but all need turning and boring and then tyres fitting.
Treibrad, für 1400er Rad, 16 Speichen, für Kurbelradius 9,5 +/- 0,5mm, passend zu 1.0532 - Bauteile für Lokomotiven
Radreifen, Edelstahl, für 1400er Rad, Spurkranzhöhe 2mm, Innen-Durchmesser 40mm, Breite 5,8mm - Bauteile für Lokomotiven

One assumes the price is for a single item, I.E. one wheel blank and one tyre.

But these are a mystery it says complete bogie, but only shows one side.
Drehgestell-Wangen komplett für V218 etc - Bauteile für Lokomotiven

Diesel wise, then the V60, V90 and V100 are achievable but probably better off picking up cheap RTR and titivating (there is no cheap V90 offering mind) but the V160 and V200 are better bought as RTR and left alone in all honesty. Steam is a mine field, some engines are highly complex (Br.44, Br.50 etc) and thus expensive in time and parts, others like the Br.80, 86 and 64 less so. The Br.78 needs sorting but in reality would take as much work as a new build if you wanted top drawer, I may just leave it at garden level and enjoy it for that rather than rebuild to layout level, it's not going anywhere and is slowly maturing under the bench, I'll look at it again once I've cleared the desk of more important W1 stuff.
 

Richard Spoors

Western Thunderer
Oh dear :rolleyes:

Mick, have you become a member of Spur 1 Gemeinschaftsforum? I have tried, but for some reason each time I click on the apply to register button I get the following reply "The registration is currently disabled".
Also the Spur 1 team Rhein - Neckar have some interesting detailing parts here Kleinteile (Bastelartikel, Preise usw.)
I've just bought laser cut pieces to detail the cab of the Kiss BR98.8 shown here, after the description of work to finesse the cv's to improve the running of the motor and fit extra pickups BR 98.8 von Kiss

Cheers

Richard
 

Richard Spoors

Western Thunderer
Mick, the only German source of wheels I am aware of in Spur 1 is Home

At the moment I'm not sure if they are taking orders as I have had no reply to a request for new tyres for a Marklin BR91.

Cheers

Richard
 

mickoo

Western Thunderer
No I haven't tried to become a member of that site and I see that Rhein Neckar do replacement wheels for the MBW V200.1, might need some of them shortly ;).

There's some nice articles on that site, yet another rabbit hole to extract myself from.

I am a member here Drehscheibe Online Foren :: 04 - Historische Bahn and there's some excellent images in there, but all frustratingly small size due to the forum limits I suspect. However, despite being a member and registered I cannot log in and when asking for a new password etc says my account is not recognized :rolleyes: I simply assume it's the Germans being very German, it just takes a little longer to find what i want and it's often easier to use Google with the prefix drehscheibe to search the site ;)
 

Richard Spoors

Western Thunderer
Yes, they are brass castings. The late Wilfried Gross (Wilgro) was a manufacturer of gauge 0 and 1 models and lived in a small village in the German state of Hessen. He had a workshop with a small foundry and produced his own brass castings. He died suddenly in late December 2011 (sadly whilst working in his workshop) and a year later his business was bought by Wyco Herzlich willkommen bei Wyko Echtdampf Eisenbahnen - Unsere Neuheiten who now market his remaining stock through his old company name, which they also bought.
Wilfried Gross was a regular at Sinsheim and produced several models in gauge 1, his last being a Prussian BR56 2-8-0. One of his several unfinished models was a DRG class 23 that I photographed in his workshop during a visit in September 2011.

Cheers

Richard
 

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  • Wilgro BR 23.jpg
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mickoo

Western Thunderer
I assume they are brass castings Mick, not difficult to produce tyres and fit ;)

Col.
Colin, yes they look like brass castings but they also offer stainless steel tyres

Radreifen, Edelstahl, für 1400er Rad, Spurkranzhöhe 2mm, Innen-Durchmesser 40mm, Breite 5,8mm - Bauteile für Lokomotiven

Already turned for £1.64 plus postage, the only down side I can see to stainless steel is the inability to blacken them, unless there is a solution for that material ? Plus the width of tread and depth of rim, 5.8 mm and 2.0 mm, Ideally you want something around 5.0 mm and 1.5 mm to look good and still perform on less than scale track. Turning stainless would be a bit of a chore.

I'd be less concerned at turning brass than cast iron but getting the rims on square might tax my limited skill base and I don't have a four jaw chuck to enable accurate gripping of the casting to make the first concentric cut on which everything else depends. either way I'll need to finally get that rolling centre I've been on about, fairly sure my tail stock is MT2.

Mark Woods does split pin axles at a reasonable price which I like the look of, yes you can probably make them cheaper, but I'm not time or skill rich :cool:
Misc parts

That's why the Br.60 would be an ideal starter project into things like this, or you may just get a bag of bits thrust into your mits at Sudbury shortly with corresponding cash to sort it all for me ;)

I'd like to stick with 3/16" axles as I have some small top hat roller bearings I'd like to use to reduce friction.
 

Wagonman

Western Thunderer
For the benefit of Mickoo, and anyone else with a Märklin V200, here are a couple of snaps I managed to blag inside the cab of the one in the Berlin Technical Museum. It's a 'must-visit' should you ever find yourself in that part of Berlin with a few hours to spare...


Richard

V200 cab int 1.jpg

V200 cab int 2.jpg


Apologies for the crap lighting!
 

mickoo

Western Thunderer
Oh dear, whilst rummaging through boxes of photos looking for the V200 in Denmark, I came across some self processed (used to have a dark room) B&W images from Germany that I'd only ever printed one or two images off, which then led to another merry chase to find said negatives long since lost and forgotten about.

Just a quick test run to see if they come out all right.
Image5-2.jpg
103 177-2 heads South out of Hamburg station. I always thought (and still do) these were stunning machines, probably the best looking electrics in the world in my eyes. Marklin do one but they don't come up for sale often on Ebay and are not cheap, still dreadfully regret not grabbing the special offer one at Warley a few years ago, a snip at £800!!

This is the first time this image has ever been processed, still in good condition over 30 years later. I reckon with a better scanner they'd clean up pretty well. This and others will be uploaded large size to my Flickr site in due course, I'll stick the odd relevant or interesting one up here if there's any interest.

Enjoy.
 

Dikitriki

Flying Squad
I'll stick the odd relevant or interesting one up here if there's any interest.

Enjoy.

Hi Mick

Lovely photo, and I agree, a stunning locomotive.

I've been wondering about electrics outside, wondering whether the imagination can supply the OHLE. I'm considering a section with demountable masts only (longer term) for photographic purposes. I've recently acquired a Hubner E94....just to test the theory you understand:)

Richard
 

mickoo

Western Thunderer
I've recently acquired a Hubner E94....just to test the theory you understand:)

Richard

Amazing how quickly you can dislike some people :))

Seriously, awsome piece of kit, I think they looked rather dashing in beige and blue, the few that did get repainted of course.

I keep steering away from electrics because of exactly what you say, no OHLE, maybe we shouldn't, in gauge 1 they would be quite strong and easily removeable, besides I'd have no excuses not to progress a TEE Br.110 Bügelfalten, a 3D printed cab would be one way to go, but I'm wondering if in gauge 1 it might be easier to form certain parts in 0.010" brass and tease into shape. The 103 on the other hand would have to be 3D printed or a master made up and cast like Simon did with his DMU.

If I get time I hope to bash up a test TRAXX cab from scrap brass shortly, but theres too many pots on this hob at the moment ;)
 

mickoo

Western Thunderer
Blimey, that's enough to make a grown man weep!

Book marked and if it's going for the right price is worth a punt :thumbs:

Not so sure about my calibre though LOL.
 

D816Foxhound

Western Thunderer
......talk about being distracted by distractions! Found this while looking for more photos of the Hubner E94.

A nice comparison shot of the gauge 1 MBW V200.1 and Marklin V200.0

www.flickr.com/photos/68463452@N06/17003758808/in/pool-spur1/

and the rest of the website has plenty of other gauge 1 / 1:32nd scale items - steam, diesel, electric, buildings, cars, lorries, etc.

www.flickr.com/groups/spur1/pool/page1

There's even a quayside diorama/layout in 1:32nd with ship, cranes, dockside building, wagons and overhead wires!! ( bottom of page 3).

Roger
 

mickoo

Western Thunderer
A big box arrived today, a very big box infact, inside was a smaller but equally impressively large and heavy box.

First impressions, bloody hell it's heavy, seriously heavy, just shy of 4Kg, why is this important, well, even a small depot layout with two maybe three of these engines is going to need some serious substructure to support all this weight.
IMG_5051.jpg

IMG_5057.jpg

IMG_5058.jpg
Second impressions, me likie, I've never been a big fan of the V100 but they do look kinda appealing in the flesh.
IMG_5056.jpg
It's a typical large scale model or garden bahn target zone, it's also quite an old model but for that reason is cheaper than more modern renditions by Marklin.

Underneath was the first disappointment, all the images I'd seen showed drive shafts and small gear boxes on each axle like the prototype.
IMG_5052.jpg
Not so this early rendition, this basically precludes any serious detail work below the floor and immediately sets it in the garden zone for me, not that I have a problem with that at all and some basic titivation will lift it nicely to an engine at the back of the layout.

One thing that did come in the box was a spare set of wheels, the previous owner had taken off the nylon tyres and soldered up the resultant groove with solder :confused: they're best left in the bag to be honest ;).

This model clearly has new tyres, the originals in the bag look like the chrome plating has started to flake and these have rubber tyres instead of nylon. I don't like tyres, shades of Hornby tender driven :shit: and they slip, well they grip the rail really well, but slip on the wheels and why does an engine that weights nearly 4Kg need traction tyres for heavens sake ? The other down side is that there are four tyres, which by basic math leaves 4 wheels to pick up power, mind this thing has so much mass it just rolls over any gaps or shorts I suspect.

I could try and source some spare Marklin solid wheels and axles and replace the traction tyre ones, or just fit new fine'r' scale wheels through out.

Anyway I was curious as to what mechanism powered these 'spuds'
IMG_5054.jpg
WTF is this :eek: it looks like something out of a Flash Gordon movie, hmm not sure what to make of this, actually they look more like washing machine drum motors (probably better than the :shit: they put in modern washing machines in all honesty).

I've not powered it up yet, it says digital and there is an encoder but no sound, given it's age it might be this antique Marklin system I recall reading about somewhere. So not really sure if any of this is worth spending any time on at all, it might be easier to rip all that junk out and fit a new ESU XL decoder with V100 sound pack or simply just wire it for DC for the time being to see if these Frankenstein motors work:cool:.

The bogie detail is quite nice, a little 2D in places but nothing overly disappointing.
IMG_5055.jpg
I do love the little red and clear screw in pygmy lamps :p I think LEDs might be in order here, which will be a requirement if I do any sort of work on the grills as inside are some massive perspex light bars which will need re-moving.

Overall, despite it's apparent age and crudeness in certain aspects due to it's age it's a nice model and at just a smidge over £200 a good bargain. The body work is it's best point, the chassis is a bit 'Dinky' toy and the motors are pure Frankenstein.

Whats to do,
:-Well maybe some decent glazing and etched window surrounds.
:-I'd like to trim off the molded handles and replace with fine wire ones, but that'll mean a re-spray, no issue with that except DB Epoch IV decals. :-Maybe open out the exhaust and boiler ports and maybe some ploughs though they are not that common.
:-Some small details in the cab to liven that up, especially if new clearer and thinner glazing is fitted.
:-No idea on the motors, if they run smooth and slowly I'll leave alone, if not then a replacement can type with associated metal work.
:-New finer wheels...maybe.
:-New recessed radiator side grills, again a respray called for.
:-Finally, new sound fitted decoder that work with modern systems.

:-Or, as is more likely, do nothing and just play with it LOL

What I will do though is make detailed notes on all the markings and sizes, I'll also use this as a basis to check the art work on the etched project.

If you want something to kit bash and tart up then these older models at the going rate, even with German postage.....actually half the price it cost me to send something to the next town and half the weight in the UK!....are good bargins.

I just missed a Marklin Eph IV V200 by 22p tonight :rant: and I've my eye on a couple of Kof's at the moment, as well as one or two others ;)

Right, back to the W1 cab art work :thumbs:
 
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Steph Dale

Western Thunderer
Mick,
Those motors look like the old Maerklin HO motor. There are ways round the problem and I'm tempted to suggest looking to see what those nice people at SBModellbau can do in terms of a drop-in. I've got a couple of HO-scale locos with SB motor kits and they run superbly.
In principle though, yes; it's crying out for a more 'scale' drive system. I'm far from certain, but are the bits and pieces I do any help in that regard?
Steph
 
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