Modelling a GWR prototype : CARROG in 4mm & 7mm.

Discussion in 'Workbenches, including workshop techniques.' started by LarryG, 7 February 2019.

  1. LarryG

    LarryG Western Thunderer

    In January 2017 I returned to 4mm/00 with a determination to build something manageable. Permission to measure up Carrog station on the Llangollen line was obtained and I was there on New Years Day 2017 with tape, notepad and biro! Seeing as I built the station buildings in 4mm scale and 7mm scale (just in case I went back to 0 gauge), images from both scales will be used to cover the construction.
    WEB Carrog 2.jpg
    Last edited: 7 February 2019
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  2. LarryG

    LarryG Western Thunderer

    Construction started with the waiting room and present-day tearooms. The building was photographed side-on and several important measurement were taken on site after seeking permission. The side-on photo was then printed out to 4mm scale to act as a scale drawing and Wills SSMP 200 Random Stone cut out. The length of the wall is 44'.
    WEB Carrog 3.jpg WEB Carrog 4.jpg WEB Carrog 5.jpg
    An etched brass window frame was used initially, which truth to tell was too small. This was what led me to drawing window frames in paint on thick glazing...
    WEB Carrog 15.jpg
    WEB Carrog 6.jpg WEB Carrog 7.jpg
    The slate canopy was made from Wills SSMP 203 plastic slate sheet as was the roof. The two halves of the roof were taped together so that the roof could be accurately positioned on the stone walls...
    WEB Carrog 8.jpg WEB Carrog 9.jpg WEB Carrog 10.jpg
    Last edited: 7 February 2019
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  3. LarryG

    LarryG Western Thunderer

    Detail shot of the real Carrog waiting rooms (Tea rooms today)....
    WEB Carrog 11.jpg
    The shot below is of the 7mm scale building. Strips of slates were cut from Slaters embossed platform paving Plastikard....
    WEB Carrog 11B.jpg WEB Carrog 12B.jpg
    The width of the canopy is 8'...
    WEB Carrog 12.jpg WEB Carrog 14.jpg
    WEB Carrog 19.jpg
    Entrance to the station from the road side....
    WEB Carrog 20.jpg
    The chimneys carry as muich detail as the rest of the building. This is the double chimney over the waiting rooms...
    WEB Carrog 21.jpg
    The quadruple chimney atop the station masters house....
    WEB Carrog 22.jpg
    Last edited: 7 February 2019
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  4. LarryG

    LarryG Western Thunderer

    In case anyone is wondering, I find that separate medium size posts keep things manageable when juggling thoughts, pictures and words. Continuing the chimney theme, I found 'Plastruct' square tubing made things easier...
    WEB Chimney 1.jpg
    The tubing was clad with Slaters English Bond embossed brick. This is a surpisingly time-consming job. The 'cement' base was made from scraps of Plastikard shaped after it was dry....
    WEB Chimney 2.jpg
    Below is the quadruple chimney...
    WEB Chimney 3.jpg
    The living quarters chimney at the east end of the roof was built around rectangular Plastruct. Finally, the appearance of the finished chimneys after colouring....
    WEB Chimney 4.jpg WEB Chimney 5.jpg
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  5. simond

    simond Western Thunderer


    That’s very nice!

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  6. LarryG

    LarryG Western Thunderer

    Thank you. When completed, the whole structure was given a coat of Halfords grey plastic primer....
    WEB Carrog 23.jpg
    Then it was sprayed sand colour slightly distressed with black using cellulose paint...
    WEB Carrog 23B.jpg
    The method of colouring stonework was arrived at when i was building Greenfield Junction on the LNWR Standedge route. How builder Peter Leyland achieved his finish was a mystery so I experimented with a concoction of red, black & yellow acrylic paint let down in a bottle with plenty of water and washing up liquid. It was brushed all over the building but didn't look right and so in a state of panic I ran the warm water tap over the building to wash it off. Where the acrylic had dried, it stayed put, but the wet paint was washed off and out of the cement courses. Ureeka! After that I tackled the walls one at a time so that the paint would not run out of the courses. Extra coats of the 'stain' were put on individual bricks to add character....
    WEB Carrog 25.jpg
    The characteristic bay window design was photographed from the opposite platform and printed onto matt paper. Then I painted over the design with cream and brown paint so that it will never fade....
    WEB Carrog 24.jpg
    The present day station has an additional bay window on the side of the bedroom, but I modeled it was it was in steam days....
    WEB Carrog 26.jpg
    The model was awaiting some window frames when photographed...
    WEB Carrog 26B.jpg
    The 4mm version of the building in situ before bedding into the platform. The length of the garden wall is 52' and 6'6" high....
    WEB Carrog 41.jpg
    Last edited: 8 February 2019
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  7. LarryG

    LarryG Western Thunderer

    The path beside the old waiting rooms is 5' wide and was a way out in steam days. The 8' wide Ladies and Gents toilets beside this path were not there prior to restoration and there was no Gentlemen sign on the wall. The width of the Booking Office and waiting rooms was 17'.
    WEB Carrog 43.jpg
    This platform holds six BR Mk.I coaches from ramp top to ramp top. I modeled it to hold five seeing as most local trains calling here in steam days were three coaches...
    WEB Carrog 43B.jpg
    Without a toilet block, there was merely an embankment up to the overbridge....
    WEB Carrog 45.jpg
    Two other structures on the Up platform were the goods shed and lamp room, both being typical GWR corrugated iron buildings. The goods shed is 20' long and 8' wide while the lamp room is 12' long. In steam days, the goods shed was separated from the garden wall by a gate leading to an end loading bay in the yard. Today there is an entrance from the car park beyond the tin sheds. The goods shed is set back 15' from the platform edge...
    WEB Carrog 44.jpg
    The Goods shed was built from Wills corrugated plastic sheet while the curved roof was a left over from a covered footbridge....
    WEB Carrog 46.jpg
    They started out in gloss black in BR days, but this faded to matt dark grey over time...
    WEB Carrog 46B.jpg
    Last edited: 8 February 2019
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  8. GrahameH

    GrahameH Western Thunderer


    I did follow this thread - elsewhere - when you undertook to model it, and seeing it being posted here for all to enjoy it certainly makes for a pleasant read again, thank you. Super work.

    Bob 81C, D G Williams and LarryG like this.
  9. Phil O

    Phil O Western Thunderer

    Excellent modelling, an inspiration.
  10. LarryG

    LarryG Western Thunderer

    The signalbox was built using window frames and roof from a Ratio kit. The lower part of the box was built from Wills brick sheet and Slaters English Bond embossed brick...
    WEB Signalbox 1.jpg WEB Signalbox 2.jpg
    This box is 21' long and 12' wide....

    It is set back from the platform edge 9' 6". Platfrom to window ledge is 8'.
    WEB Signalbox 3.jpg View attachment 98637
    WEB Signalbox 4B.jpg WEB Signalbox 5.jpg WEB Signalbox 6.jpg WEB Signalbox 6B.jpg WEB Signalbox 6C - Copy.jpg
    The characteristic GWR 'diamond' floor tiles was made from embossed brick and then scribed with a diamond pattern. The lot were painted engineering brick blue...
    WEB Signalbox 6D.jpg
    Last edited: 11 February 2019
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  11. LarryG

    LarryG Western Thunderer

    The small locking room windows are 33" X 32" and are spaced 82" apart. The signalbox nameboard is 11" deep and 72" wide...
    WEB Carrog signalbox.jpg
    The landing shwon below is 9' wide from the signalbox and 9' 6" long from the platform rear face....
    WEB Signalbox 8.jpg
    The interior was built from a kit (I have forgotten who's) while one of the Token machines were carved from Plastikard...
    WEB Signalbox 9.jpg WEB Signalbox 10.jpg
    I rather suspect the landing at the foot of the signalbox steps had a spearhead iron fence around it in steam days and a gate....
    WEB Signalbox 11.jpg
    Last edited: 11 February 2019
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  12. Terrysvr

    Terrysvr Member

    Stunning as usual Larry
  13. Focalplane

    Focalplane Western Thunderer

    As others have said, Larry, it is great to see, again, all the steps that were taken to build the station structures. Always inspirational and stunning stuff.

  14. LarryG

    LarryG Western Thunderer

    My old office chair was transferred to the railway shed last week and I looked in on the layout for the first time in 6 months. The prospect of ripping up a layout is usually a thing of joy because it is a prelude to building something new. But whenever I try to think of a new mainline station with trains dashing through in both directions, Dapol Pannier Tanks swim through my mind instead.........And they are O gauge! Its a recurring illness.....I've been there twice before. O gauge in my space means single line branches and I am already ripping up such a thing in 00 gauge because it is boring.

    Having lived in it for some 28 years, I am under no illusions about the steam-era. If a railway station was boring in real life then there is no reason why a model should be any less so unless it is jazzed it up with make-believe activity. Can I settle for a very quiet branch line scene in O gauge? This is something I will be asking myself in the coming weeks. :oops:
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  15. Cliff Williams

    Cliff Williams Western Thunderer

    It is the critical mass of O gauge that wins for me Larry. As mentioned over on the other forum I am working on Arley, similar to Carrog.

    You did try a modified Carrog with extra sidings, might I suggest keep it simple, but on the other side of the shed put in a small shunting area if there is space?
    LarryG likes this.
  16. Focalplane

    Focalplane Western Thunderer

    One unusual aspect of Carrog is that it can be modelled in two distinct eras yet with very little change between the two except the rolling stock. I am thinking late 1950s and today’s heritage railway. The latter option is one I have under Rule 1 for Penmaenpool except that it doesn’t exist, whereas Carrog does. And the same applies to Cliff’s Arley as well.

    If and when you get bored with one era, switch to the other?

    My thought for the day, Paul
  17. LarryG

    LarryG Western Thunderer

    Thanks for your thoughts Paul, but I'm afraid it isn't possible. I can pop over to Carrog in 40 minutes any time. This attraction allows me to get a 'fix' of living steam whenever I want, but I would not dream of modelling it. I prefer the discipline of historical modelling and the agonizing over which particular year to model! :)

    Questions arising are scale plus have I the time these days. O gauge would be the easier option, but would it be anymore satisfying than the present Carrog? The recreation of early 1950's Ruabon in OO is something else though and is not a minor challenge. In my minds eye it is perfect with Castles rolling through on the mainline, smaller locos departing the bay for Barmouth and all-day marshalling of trains in the Up and down yards. But experience has taught me that dreams do not always convert into reality at the end of the day. It'll get sorted in the coming weeks. Blimey, I'll be lying down in a dark room if I'm not careful... :D
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  18. Compton castle

    Compton castle Western Thunderer

    I agree with cliff it’s the weight and presence of O gauge for me that I find so appealing.
    I did enjoy your O gauge adventures last year but then I enjoy your modelling regardless of scale
    Steve Fay
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  19. LarryG

    LarryG Western Thunderer

    Thanks for your input Cliff and Steve. I think the best course now is to run OO and O in parallel until I have made up me mind. If I buy a Pannier, it can run on a friends O gauge layout. The final three OO coaches are on the go and so I haven't completely turned the tap off although truth to tell, they are really to get me back into the earning a crust mode.
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  20. Focalplane

    Focalplane Western Thunderer


    I still have the brass San Cheng Pannier you sold me, it's hardly been used since I got it as I have been building the layout and it stayed in its box for most of the time. Interested?