7mm MOK BR Standard 4MT Tank

P A D

Western Thunderer
Some further progress on the springs and hangers. Here are some of the parts after preparation.
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And all in place with the axle bearings. The front and middle axles are on the compensation beams and the rear axle rock on a steel rod fitted later.

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And some further views. I ran out of brass 12BA cheese head bolts so had to use steel ones. I've got some brass 12BA hex bolts on order and will replace the cheese head ones later.
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And a couple the right way up.
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And a close up of the front and middle bearings, springs and hangers.
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And the rear one.
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Cheers,
Peter
 

P A D

Western Thunderer
As mentioned earlier by Dog Star and others, the spring hanger blocks are not representative of how they were in service. It seems that the adjusting nut/ lock nut set up under the block is a post preservation modification. After considering this further I decided to saw off the cast nut and counter sink the hold for the 12BA screw, and switch from cheese head to counter sunk screws. On the left is the original set up and on the right after modification.
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This is one on 80002 at Oxenhope.
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And one side completed. The tie bar above the rear spring has yet to be added.
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And all 12 completed. One or two need counter sinking a little more but I will come back to that.
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Next the mount for the ABC gearbox.
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Here you can see the steel rod on which the motor mount pivots to compensate the rear axle.
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And with the mount on the pivot . Ad can be seen it rocks to one side due to the weight of the brass nuts and screws which fasten the side plate to the motor mount.
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At this stage I'm not sure how the gear box and motor are fitted (I don't have them yet), or if the square bearings are superfluous and the axle is supported in the gear box bearings only. If that is the case I won't be able to trial fit the wheels and rods to check for free running, as the rear bearings will just bottom out in the slots. If so I'll make a start on the body until I can get the motor.

Cheers,
Peter
 

P A D

Western Thunderer
Here's the chassis with the wheels in. The back end sags as the bearings bottom out in the slots without the gear box.
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I've moved onto the body for now until I can get the gear box and motor.

This is the boiler under construction. There is double ring at the front which lines up the boiler and smoke box.
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The instructions suggest using wire to hold the boiler seam in line for soldering, but I saw these plastic cable clips being used on a thread by John Kneeshaw on the Gauge O Guild forum, so I gave them a try. They worked a treat. At the other end of the boiler is a recessed ring in a half etched slot.
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Before soldering the boiler seam and rings the cast pockets for the clack valves need to be soldered inside the boiler. Again, I stole a neat idea from another modeller, Tony Geary, to ease the fitting of these castings. The hole for fitting the clack was drilled and tapped 12BA. A simple U shaped frame with a hole drilled in the middle was made from waste etch and the casting can then be locked in place for soldering on the inside. Also works a treat so thanks to John and Tony for the ideas.
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And with the clamp removed. Neatly lined up and no cleaning on the outside required, and no burnt fingers.
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I made a start o the smoke box but then ran out of time. Here's the smoke box part prepared with the detail overlay.
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Cheers,
Peter
 

Ian_C

Western Thunderer
Lot 10.
This is the last. Hope these have been useful to anyone building the 4MT, or have one in the pipeline, or on a wish list.
Cheers,
Peter
I'm not building a 4MT, however these are really useful detail photos. They show a lot of late British steam custom and practice and they're a very useful guide to weathering. Thanks.
 

P A D

Western Thunderer
Thanks Ian.

I've downloaded lots of other people's photos over the years to help me with my builds, so only fair to share some of mine.

I made a detour last week on the way back from a business trip and found this little beauty in steam in the yard at Ropley on the Mid Hants. Needless to say, I went into a clicking frenzy. I'll upload them in the gallery some time.
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Cheers,
Peter
 

P A D

Western Thunderer
Next the smoke box is attached to the forward ring on the boiler, with an additional ring recessed in a groove just inside the front. If all is well, the line from the front to the rear along the bottom seam, should be straight.
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The the overlay is then added. Here it is rolled ready to fit. Again mini tabs and slots help to locate it correctly.
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And after soldering and cleaning up.
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I then went back to the chassis and made a temporary spacer with an 8BA nut soldered over the central hole. The spacer was then located on top of the horn guides, and the mini locating tabs for the frame overlays, that I did not use, were bent inwards to secure the spacer. An 8BA bolt and nut were added, the bolt screwed down to level the frames and the lock nut tightened. This will allow me to add the rods and test run the chassis without the motor.
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Now the front frame extensions. Again mini tabs and slots help to locate and line every thing up before soldering. Here they are part assembled with the frame overlays ready to go on.
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And slotted onto the tabs.
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An underside view after soldering.
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And from the top.
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Then the running plate is added.
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And a view of the underside.
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When I test fitted the saddle into the slots in the smoke box, it would not fit level due to the line of rivets at the rear. As there is a gap in the rivets at the front, my first though was that I had put the smoke box on back to front! Fortunately that is not the case and the gap at the front is to allow the curved top edge of the drop plate to match the curve of the smoke box. After scribing where the edge of the saddle was either side, I removed the offending rivets with a rifler file.
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Now it sits nicely.20180601_205333.jpg20180601_205405.jpg

And a view from the front after the running plate was added. 20180601_205826.jpg

Here is the boiler and front frames/running plate placed on the chassis.
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I'm at the maximum of 15 images per post so I'll finish for now.
Cheers,
Peter
 

P A D

Western Thunderer
Here's a cock up I made due to an error in the instructions. Having read Tony Geary's thread on Rmweb, I remember that he put the buffer beam on the wrong way round. So I was extra careful to get mine on correctly. As can be seen, comparing the work piece to the photo in the instructions, I got it right.
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WRONG!
When I came to fit the overlay, the buffer beam was now the opposite way round and the hanging brackets don't match.
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Oh bother I said, and put it away. :rant:

It's easy enough to fix by cutting off the brackets on the beam and replacing with parts made from waste etch. Or, I could take a blow torch to it..... Nah.
Cheers,
Peter
 

P A D

Western Thunderer
So having had time to consider the options, I decided that I could probably remove the buffer beam without causing any damage. I placed the unit buffer beam down on a block of wood, flooded the rear with flux and with the iron fired up to 450 C, pressed the tip down firmly on the inner surface in the middle and watched the heat flow out left and right. I then carefully folded the unit over at the running plate/ buffer beam joint and the two separated. No collateral damage and nothing else moved. Here if is after cleaning up ready to refit.
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And refitted along with the front steps, rivet strips, grab rails and the valance to the drop plate. The foot steps under the running plate are also fitted.
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And from the underside showing the webbing behind the buffer beam.
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Here's a view showing the right hand footsteps and drop plate valance.
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Next the rear bulk head for cab. The half etche door overlays have folding tabs on the hinges, that fit into slots in bulk head. After slotting in they are soldered on the inside, so cleaning up, if any is minimal. The locker extends up to the roof which believe is incorrect and if should stop short. However, it will give some support to the roof and will not be visible so I've left it alone.
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Here's the cab rear plate with the bulk head and lockers. I've drilled the missing vent holes I the cab rear. There are 19 on the locker but I believe 15 are correct.
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And the two parts soldered together. I've jumped the gun here and should have done this later, but I don't think it will cause any problems. There's a nice representation of the latch on the coal doors.
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Here's the cab rear and bunker rear after adding the footsteps and grab rails.
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And the other side of the bunker rear with the bottom plate. All the step and grab rail stubs having been clipped and dressed back.
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Here's the support for the cab floor. A couple of extra grooves not present on the etch have to be filed each side where the cab output is. This is mentioned in the instructions.

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This is the underside with the strengthened clipped in place with the mini tabs.20180605_202148.jpg

Here is the bunker fitted to the cab rear.

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And inside the bunker with the inner sloping sides fitted. Again the soldering is done on the inner non visible areas so only minimal cleaning up is required.
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And the underside. The cab floor support is just slotted in place. The box structure with the hole has and 8BA nut soldered on the other side and I assume the is for the rear body to chassis fixing.
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And flipped over again showing it from the front.
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Cheers,
Peter
 

farnetti

Western Thunderer
Hi Peter,

I just realised I missed your note in Post 33. The answer is I am and showing occasional photos in Dikitrikis 'What's on your workbench.'

Your photos have been most helpful and I will revisit where I am at the moment to check everything. I missed the ventilation holes on the rear spectacle plate but there is a photo the coal is loaded so high they would be difficult to see (that's my excuse anyway).

So far I have found this a great build but the instructions sort of run out of steam towards the end and so your photos are invaluable. There are many more parts than described and seem to be for minor variations or modifications. Mine is 80064 which was originally for the LMR, went to the Southern and then the Western, parts are included for the changes that took place.

Ken
 

P A D

Western Thunderer
Hi Ken,
Thanks for the positive comments . I'm glad you found the photos of 80002 useful.

I've been through the posts on your build and downloaded the photos and will study what you've done to see what I can learn. I see you copied Adrian's method of fixing the clack valve inserts, which I did also, albeit with Tony Geary's modification. It worked a treat and made fixing these items so much easier.

I had a chat with Tony Geary at Donny and he made a similar comment to you re. the MOK instructions. I'll see if I come to the same conclusion as the build progresses. So far I have no complaints.

Here's where I'm at after the last post. Not much more but still moving forward.
I've added the lockers either side of the main one plus the overlay for the brake and water pick up handles, the cast handles and hand rails to the rear of the cab doors.
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And a view of the sub assembly placed on the frames 20180606_165311.jpg

Cheers,
Peter
 
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P A D

Western Thunderer
Just a quick breakfast post after a short session. Here is the cab front plate prepared and cleaned up. The main etch at the back has fold out mini tabs to locate the two larger overlays, with the two small ones having to be held in the traditional way before soldering. The mini tabs have been snipped off but don't need any dressing as they will be inside the fire box/side tanks. The two remaining larger tabs are for resting the cast firebox on.20180607_183627.jpg

Cheers,
Peter
 

Martin Shaw

Western Thunderer
Peter
There's something about the cab rear bulkhead that doesn't seem right, and from the deep recesses of what passes for a brain I think it's to do with the coal hole doors. When both the top and bottom doors are open I don't recall anything between them. I would need to check and I am at Boness early next week so I can have a look at 105 then.
Regards
Martin
 

P A D

Western Thunderer
Martin,
Thanks for the heads up. I'm pretty sure you are correct. I believe the upper and lower coal doors are a bit like a stable door and can be opened independently or together at the same time. I think there are some sort of clasps between the upper and lower doors to link them. Rather annoyingly, I did not take a single photo of the rear bulk head when I was in the cab of 80002 on the KWVR. :rant:
I've had a look at my brother's DJB example and I can see the doors are linked so that is another point to DJB. I tell you what, these MOK kits are not all they are reckoned to be! No vent holes in the back of the cab, coal doors wrong, where's it going to end? ;)

Looking through the cab cut out on the DJB one, it's not easy to see the link in the doors, so I am going to leave things as they are.

Cheers,
Peter
 
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P A D

Western Thunderer
Thanks Dave.
Looks like there are a couple of grab rails as well.

Martin,
I just found these in my prototype files - I think you posted them on another thread.
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They bear out the photo posted by Dave, so I think that clears things up. However, as I said, I'm leaving well alone as they can hardly be seen on the completed model.

It looks like the covers over the recesses where the brake and pick up handles are, have been dispensed with, and a tip up seat added on the left side. Also of note is that the top of the locker is straight and does not reach all the way to the roof, and no vent holes.
Cheers,
Peter
 

Martin Shaw

Western Thunderer
Peter
I told you my brain didn't work well, how embarassing. However note that the tip up seat is a preservation addition and the cab rear above the locker may or may not have vent holes, can't quite remember although the cab front definitely does.
Regards
Martin
 

P A D

Western Thunderer
The next stage is to construct the skeleton for the side tanks. This is the beginning of the right hand tank assembly. Two sub sections tabbed and slotted, but no solder.
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And linked together.
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Andd then this curved piece is added to the lower inside edge.
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And this right angled piece to the top inside edge.
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The completed tank skeleton is then tabbed to the front spectacle plate.
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Next, without making the right angled folds to the top edges, the outer pieces are tabbed to the tanks, cab and bunker. You dont need to twist all the tabs at this stage. A temporary strengthening piece is tabbed to the front and rear spectacle plates. Adding these three pieces makes the structure more rigid, but it can still be manipulated to get things square. This was checked for squareness on a glass plate and adjusted until it sat flat without any rocks. Once happy that all is square soldering can begin on the inner structure but avoiding any solder coming into contact with the two outer plates on the skeleton. I started at the rear bulk head and worked forward a bit at a time, checking again on the plate, before the next bit was soldered. Once it is rigid, the twisted tabs are straightened and the outer plates removed. The remaining joints are then soldered and the work piece washed and dried, before snipping the soldered tabs and dressing back.
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You then have to make the folds in outer pieces before refitting. Also there are some half etched holes to be drilled out for the tank vents. On the left hand side you have to choose whether you need the large vent close to the spectacle, or smaller one further forward. I drilled both sets as I have not decided which prototype to represent and will fill the holes I don't need later.20180608_205438.jpg
Once the folds are made the sides are tabbed back onto the skeleton for soldering. That's as far as I got for now.
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I couldn't resist having a play before I called it a day.20180608_193005.jpg

Starting to look like a Standard 4 now.c
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And a comparison with the DJB version.
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Cheers,
Peter
 

michael080

Western Thunderer
these MOK kits are a miracle. One day, I want to build one. A little practicing will be needed first :)

I enjoy watching how the shape forms from the etches. Almost like real loco building.

Michael
 
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