Prototype G1 Western

Discussion in 'G1/32' started by D1054, 30 September 2018.

  1. D1054

    D1054 Western Thunderer

    Hi, Sorry I've been away from the Thunder a while, but hope to be around more now, and back on the modelling front. Yes, there are now 5 x 1/32 Scale prototype Westerns in build, and seven in G1. I've been trying to get a traction motor solution, but those damn inside frames on Wizzo's don't leave right lot of space!
     
  2. David Halfpenny

    David Halfpenny Western Thunderer

    quote[those damn inside frames on Wizzo's don't leave right lot of space!]/quote

    Too Right! Designed for Cardan shafts.

    So may I ask:
    - what clearance between frames have you got?
    - given that G1MRA Standard is costing you 2mm you can't afford, what clearance might you have, were you to slim-down the frames as brutally as your aesthetic conscience will allow?
    - and what wheelbase, please ?

    David 1/2d
     
  3. David Halfpenny

    David Halfpenny Western Thunderer

    D1054

    Would this sort of power bogie help?

    These are for a Deltic, and with six axle-hung gear-motors in total, it hauls an eye-wateringly long train at 100mph.

    Peter Jackman Deltic Bogie.png

    The "N20" type gearmotors are nominally 1 200rpm at 12V geared 1:1 to the axles. The plastic cases keep the muck out. Power is via radio-controlled PWM from a 12V battery.
    In this configuration, the wheelsets have outside bearing, fully-equalised in the Bettendorf rocker-bogie manner.​

    By using narrower pinions, maybe you could squeeze in inside bearings and rocker bars?
    Like this schematic (for a Mars-Rover):​

    Rocker Bogie.png

    (Equalising the axle-loads is well worthwhile, because you neither want to stall nor slip any of the motors.)

    Bogie and Photo Peter Jackman.
    To find out more, infiltrate the Gauge One 3D Circle:
    GaugeOne3DCircle groups.io Group
    (3D printing is not Of the Essence: just a handy way to experiment - heck, even Peter's wheels are printed!)
     
    jbsmith, D1054 and DelticBluePullman like this.
  4. D1054

    D1054 Western Thunderer

    Hi David, that's most helpful, and an interesting development which I must look at more closely. I'm busy turning 1/32nd wheels for the Wizzos at present so sorry if I'm slow to respond. I am using MSC, ABC and Appletree motor/gearboxes in the prototypes, but really want to crack a traction motor solution if at all possible. Easy in the G3 EM1s, but the G1 and 1/32nd Western is presenting a few challenges...
    Perhaps you'd be available for a chat sometime?
     
  5. David Halfpenny

    David Halfpenny Western Thunderer

    Sure, though not this minute :)

    If you know Apple Tree, you'll probably know Tim's drumming-up custom for a G1 version of his traction motor. He'll tell you whether he can do inside frames.
    But the essence of Tim's is the 10:1 gearing, which keeps the speed down to maybe 50mph.
    The me as a Midland man, that seems a sensible speed for a clapped-out Western, but True Fans might want the full 90mph originally specified.​

    I doubt a FosMotor could do inside frames on G1MRA Standard track, though it might just in G1MRA Fine.

    David
     
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  6. D1054

    D1054 Western Thunderer

    #1.jpg Hi All, Just to update on the G1 prototype which I'm finishing over the week or so before it's off to its new owner. Then on the the next one - in 1/32nd.
     

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    JimG, 3 LINK, D6356 and 11 others like this.
  7. D6356

    D6356 Western Thunderer

    That does look very nice ! A lot of work so well done to get it that far. Kits later ?
    Robert
     
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  8. D1054

    D1054 Western Thunderer

    Hi Robert,
    I'm hopefully finishing the build today, and then I'm going to put parts together for another 7 off. in Gauge 1 and 7 off. in 1/32nd. I also have two in Gauge 3 which people have asked for. They're certainly not "standard" kits, but will come together nicely if you put some time and effort in.... :)
     
  9. D1054

    D1054 Western Thunderer

    Well, not quite finished, but Enterprise was back in the paintshop after driver and detail installed, cab roofs fitted, rain guards attached, bogie spring guards fitted, OHLEs applied, then roof sprayed to blend.... just speedo, sandpipes and roof eyelets (not sure how best to do these... any ideas?), and final weathering... then on the 1/32nd scale version. W1.jpg W2.jpg
     
  10. Thirtysecond

    Thirtysecond Western Thunderer

    My Fred Phipps Warship uses a FosMotor on each axle. The only requirement was to significantly turn down the thickness of the bearings in the bogie frames to allow room for the unit . I was initially worried about wear with the reduced bearing surface. But actually, with careful cleaning and lubrication, it has never been a problem and it must be 15 years old now. If you have seen it running you will know it is very smooth and can maintain scale speeds with ease.

    B3675519-E1F9-43DC-A59D-B73DF30B1B9B_1_201_a.jpeg
     
  11. David Halfpenny

    David Halfpenny Western Thunderer

    So have you slipped metal bogie frames in between the Fosmotor frames and the wheels, Derek?
    Or something more sophisticated? ​
     
  12. Thirtysecond

    Thirtysecond Western Thunderer

    No that's it exactly. But the bearings when turned down to fit are not much thicker than the frames!! I seem to remember that it was made easier because I used Mark Wood wheels on telescopic axles. Not sure if he does those axles any more.
     
  13. Thirtysecond

    Thirtysecond Western Thunderer

    Two possibilities.
    • Fred Phipps supplied a casting sprue of roof eyelets which I used on the Warship. If you look carefully at the above picture you can just see them. Fred always seems willing to supply castings and other parts to help people out so might be worth contacting.
    • 1/32" cotter pins if you can still get them. I bought a gross of them donkey's years ago. They've been really useful but only have about 4 left now! Obviously they are not quite right as they are not perfectly circular . Better than nothing though.

    1. IMG_3045.JPG
     
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  14. daifly

    daifly Western Thunderer

  15. Remco Vegting

    Remco Vegting Member

    What an impressive build! Look forward to your next project ;-)
     
  16. D1054

    D1054 Western Thunderer

    Hi, many thanks for this. I met with Steve Foster and I do have a set of frames and motors from him, but I can't quite get the fit, so I'm cutting my own frames to do this. It'll be a tight squeeze, but I think there's just enough room to make it work. I'll post when I'm something meaningful to show. Many thanks again.
     
  17. D1054

    D1054 Western Thunderer

    Thanks for these - ordered! :)
     
  18. simond

    simond Western Thunderer

    Would there be sufficient of these “What about this supplier?” posts for there to be a specific thread?

    It would make searching easier in future if such suggestions were all collated in one place.

    Atb
    Simon
     
  19. Thirtysecond

    Thirtysecond Western Thunderer

    Cotter pins or Fred Phipp's castings?!
     
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  20. D1054

    D1054 Western Thunderer

    Wait and see :)