7mm US model dabblings

mickoo

Western Thunderer
I meant the trains in general become mundane, so you start taking photos of anything to keep you're interest up :D

Not sure how to recognise a 125T version.

Coal wagon - Wildwood FL

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Centre Beam Bulkhead - Wildwood FL

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Double stacks - Cajon CA

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To be honest I'm just going through last years secondary photos and I've hundreds more from previous Florida vacations to process as yet.
 

Big Train James

Western Thunderer
It's fairly simple to identify 125 ton trucks, if you know what to look for. The trucks aren't all that common, except on double stack trains. The intermediate trucks on well cars tend to be of the 125 ton variety, with 38" diameter wheels. The two end trucks I think are typically 70 ton trucks, but I'm not 100% sure about that. They might be 100 ton.

The easiest way to identify the size of truck is by the number cast into the side frame at the top left corner. In modern terms, on common rolling stock, it should typcially say either 68, 70, or 72, which represents the nominal wheelbase of the truck. 70 ton trucks are usually 5'-8" wheelbase, 100 ton trucks are typically 5'-10", and 125 ton trucks are 6'-0" even.

Another usual giveaway is if you can catch the wheel diameter on the side or end of the car. 33" = 70 ton, 36" = 100 ton, and 38" = 125 ton.
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I'll take more of those big yellow thingies too, if you have the time and inclination....:thumbs::D
 

Genghis

Western Thunderer
Wow! I'm a bit out of date with heavy haul. I knew that US commonly operated 35 ton axle load, but are they really up to 62.5 tons with these artics?
 

mickoo

Western Thunderer
I don't know the maximum capacity for 48' and 53' containers, but suspect they're limited to the same as 20' and 40' which is 33 t and 32 t respectively.

The reason the 40' is derated is it's length and to prevent sagging in the middle, you can over come that by strengthening the structure, but that adds weight and thus less carrying capacity. Flat racks can go higher, typically in the 50-60t range but then you're pushing the limits of the twistlock which is usually rated at 12.5 t. Anything over 50 t and we remove the spreader and use special fixing point rated much higher.

This would of been a wire lift off special fixing points.

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Wire lift off special points on the spreader. This load does not exceed 60t as that is the cranes maximum capacity so suspect the spreader points are rated at 15 t each.

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Beams attached to the spreader twistlocks so maximum rated here would be 50t

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Biggest load I've seen over the quay face.

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Single point beam attached directly to the headblock (spreader removed) so above twistlock rating of 50 t and special points at 60 t. The maximum lift capacity for this crane is 85 t in a single lift so best guess for this load is between 60-80 t. Our newer cranes will go to 100 and I dimly recall the very latest might be 125 t but I don't get to work on them that often so not sure.

Anyway, back on track, if we take 33t as the nominal weight for a container then each wagon could theoretically have 66 t plus the weight of the wagon it's self.
Most double stacks seem to be plated at 119,xxx lbs some are ,200, 400 etc but most are just over 119,000 lbs which in real (american) money is 59.5 t. Thus each intermodal wagon cannot load two fully weighted containers.

That's not so much of a problem as you might imagine, most big boxes (40' - 53' range) are designed to carry a lot of light weight products, mostly volume rather than weight, things like clothing, white goods etc, your heavy stuff tends to go in 20'.

So working on 59 t maximum plus lets say 7 t for the actual wagon then you're looking at 66 t per car average, at one end that'll be supported by a truck with two axles so 16.5 t per axle, in the middle it'll be one axle at 33 t.

Which means that the 125 t moniker is not the carrying capacity per truck though I suspect in some cases on specialised railroads (RBW in the Rhur springs to mind) it would be possible to use these truck to that sort of weighting.

I'd read somewhere that maximum axle loads in the US were in the 35 t region which is close to what many locos now weight in at on six axles.

You also have to be careful with American weights, their ton is 2000 lbs, an imperial ton is 2240 lbs which is why all containers and railroad stock is marked in lbs and kg, these are constant, tons (long and short), tonnes (metric) are not.

This tank car is plated at 78,600 lbs empty and 207,400 lbs capacity, giving a total of 286,000 lbs which is 143 tons (short) and gives an axle load of 35.75t

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I'm not sure how that works for a 35 t axle load :confused: either they're not enforcing it that highly or it's higher than 35 ton, or I've got my math wrong :p

If however we use the long ton it comes out at 127.6 tons or roughly 32 t per axle.
 
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Brian McKenzie

Western Thunderer
. . . . I "might" get the chance to have a day there in the middle of May (18th/19th)

F.Y.I. albeit a long way to the north . . . .
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The 2019 O Scale National - O Scale West - S West - Narrow Gauge West Convention is coming to the Hyatt Regency Hotel in Santa Clara, CA May 23-25, 2019.

This year, marks the 29th annual O Scale West, now including S West and Narrow Gauge West. For 2019, the meet also includes the 2019 O Scale National Convention.

Much more information is available at www.oscalewest.com
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While I haven't felt the need to spend much time at the venue, a big attraction is being able to visit a large number of substantial home and club layouts on days either side and during the event, but spread over a large geographical area.
O Scale West 2016.jpg

Seriously, if you do drive to and fro in your automatic, try not to depress the "clutch" pedal :) or you'll bloody your nose on the windscreen windshield. Don't panic if it won't start - take it out of gear. Bone up on the rules for a four-way stop intersection (roundabouts are rare) and it's likely you can turn right immediately after stopping at a red light - if the way is clear. After entering a large parking lot, I still tend to circulate in a clockwise direction - to the consternation of the locals :D
-Brian McK.
 

Overseer

Western Thunderer
US freight truck ratings are always for a pair of trucks, so 125 ton is the total load capacity weight for a two-bogie wagon. The axle load is a quarter of the total so 31 1/4 T US or about 28.5 tonnes or 28 T imperial.
 
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allegheny1600

Western Thunderer
Although our tons, tons(av), tonnes and so forth differ - at least our pounds are pretty much the same, only differing by approximately 1 part in 10 million: Pound (mass) - Wikipedia
I always wondered why the US (short) ton was smaller than ours though, especially as the Americans usually like everything to be bigger* over there! Unless it's because it makes our 100T into their 112T?
Cheers,
John.

*with the famous exception of the "Billion"!
 

mickoo

Western Thunderer
A few more from the archives, it's handy doing this as it refreshes the mind about good spots and possible new ones, to be honest if I'm not careful I'll end up camped in Cajon for most of the vacation :cool:.

Taking the back road one morning I came a cross a manifest parked up at Hesperia, the lighting was good, it was a quiet, safe, reasonably isolated area with good access so I went snap happy on wagons. Couple of interesting ones, well for me anyway.

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Standard coupling view, but what is interesting is the amount of wear on the wheel rim sides, this can only come from crossings with high check rails, I've not noticed this before and certainly not as worn as this, even in this train there were none as worn as this.

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Another coupling shot, but these are different, they have much taller pulling faces, I'm heard these are a stronger type but I've also heard that the extended faces are there to prevent couplings parting vertically in an accident, the only ones I've see so far are on tank wagons.

Moving back to Summit, a view looking east and the lit fenced off area is clearly visible.

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A lot of trains stop here before descending the pass, brake checks and routing so I can see myself coming back to those two hills either side of the cutting for some night shots :thumbs: and some from here too. That's one thing I didn't do any of last time, night shots, I've one or two planned this time around, especially star shots out in the desert where there's zero light pollution.

Turning around an overall view of the new summit 138 road.

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The new road is not yet paved and there's a shoo fly half way up linking the ends of the old road each side of the cutting, this area is still accessible and a good place to watch trains. If you look to the right you'll see a horizontal crease in the cutting wall, vegetation above, nothing below, this is the level of the original summit line and the vegetation area is the old cutting wall. The whole summit area was remodeled in 1972 with the new lines lower and curves eased.

Another scenery view, with your back to Sullivans curve you can see the UP Palmdale cut off line twisting through the scenery.

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There's some good spots here, looking south as above or at the cutting in the distance looking back toward the north. to the lower left where the MOW vehicles are is BNSF Main 1-3, this is where they all meet/split at what used to be Cajon depot. The smaller road in the distance is Route 66 and behind that is I15.

One of the many distinctive rock formations around Sullivans curve.

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A stark reminder that just behind that hill where the pylons are is the San Andreas fault line, disappointingly I didn't get to experience an earthquake, despite jumping up and down on the fault line much to my youngest daughters consternation; it's something I hope I can tick off my list this time around.

Moving down the hill to Main 3 where it crosses Cajon wash, Sullivans curve is to our right and Main 1 and 2 have branched off in the far distance and over another trestle that crosses the wash. At this point Main 3 is pretty flat so this bare table was fairly hustling along at line speed, which for freight is 45 mph, in Cajon terms, 45 mph is light speed.

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Being as it was a Monday and traffic slow I headed up to Victorville to what's called natural crossover, there's nothing natural about it, it's man made for goodness sake, but still impressive. This is where BNSF Main 1 and 2 swap over, no idea why, they just do and have done for decades, way back to Santa Fe days as well.

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Hopefully this time I'll actually see a train here :eek: I also want to get into the far distance where the line passes through the trees and that small crease of a rock cut which quite a good location but difficult to get too. There's also another just north of Victorville with a pair of truss bridges that's on the revisit list this time.
 

Big Train James

Western Thunderer
Well, if you need a distraction to rouse you from your stupor, the Big Boy is supposed to be on the move on May 12th. Just a quick jaunt up the road.

The tank car couplers are double shelf couplers. They are in fact intended to keep cars from uncoupling in a derailment, and thus hopefully keep the end of one car from riding up over the next, with the coupler puncturing the other car. Tank cars are usually where you see them, I'm sure they creep in elsewhere but it's nothing typical that I know of.

There are also bottom shelf couplers, which just have the lower extension. These can be found on a much broader variety of rolling stock. I have no idea why they are specified in certain instances, but they will be seen on any number of mundane cars like covered hoppers.

Of course there is always the tradition type "E" with neither shelf. I'd say those still make up the lion's share of the couplers today.

P.s. the couplers in your first photo in the last post are examples of lower shelf couplers.
 
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JimG

Western Thunderer
Standard coupling view, but what is interesting is the amount of wear on the wheel rim sides, this can only come from crossings with high check rails, I've not noticed this before and certainly not as worn as this, even in this train there were none as worn as this.

Self-guarding frogs?

Jim.
 

Focalplane

Western Thunderer
On the subject of earthquakes, you really don't want to experience one! For one thing, no trains will be running after a big one while they check track alignment (the California faults usually move sideways with less vertical movement). Minor tremors are all right, I suppose, but the ones I have experienced always have you wondering if they are a precursor to something bigger.
 

mickoo

Western Thunderer
Self-guarding frogs?

Jim.
More than likely, though they seem (my own visual observations) to be phasing them out on main lines. Mind, there's probably still millions of them in sidings where these wagons would be shunted around for loading.
 

Jordan

Mid-Western Thunderer
Self-guarding frogs?

Jim.
Beat me to it. ;) although I thought they are only used in yards & spurs, not on the main lines. But cars do have to go in yards of course.

Thanks also to Big Train James for reminding me too of the correct term for those couplers. There's a guy on an American O forum who regularly bemoans the lack of such couplers in 1:48 scale. As they seem to be a fairly modern invention, & much of the American 'home' interest is still firmly rooted in the Transition Era (late 1950s), personally I'm not surprised. :(
 

Genghis

Western Thunderer
US freight truck ratings are always for a pair of trucks, so 125 ton is the total loaded vehicle weight for a two-bogie wagon. The axle load is a quarter of the total so 31 1/4 T US or about 28.5 tonnes or 28 T imperial.
Thank you. That explains a lot.
 

mickoo

Western Thunderer
Right, last but one update from last year as I'm just about up to date on processing them all (just over 2600 images).

Leaving Cajon it was a drive to Kingman for a three day stay, not sure if I'll do the same, maybe just one night to break up the trip to Flagstaff.

On the way I stopped off in Barstow, it has a reputation for crime sadly, mostly at night and I binned off my motel; though this year I've got one for two nights as it's the closest I can get to the desert for the dawn/dusk shots but in the more safer/expensive part of town.

Barstow is a massive shunting yard and access is difficult but there is a huge bridge across all the lines just to the east, from which can be seen the depot and the eastern staging yards, I.E trains just having a crew change as opposed to making up/breaking down.

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Much of the bridge approach road support structure is a wooden trestle.

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From the bridge a nice view of the depot can be had.

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The museum and outdoor exhibits are among the trees on the other side of the depot. The interior is beautifully restored and still in use for the two overnight Amtrak trains.

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Further east another smaller bridge spans the exit from the staging yards and BNSF 6827 is being crewed up. This looks like a local manifest and would of been sorted in the main classification behind the bridge and around to the left of the hill.

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Moving east we come to Ludlow and Ash Hill area, there's some good spots out here but early morning and late evening are the best times, the rest of the day is filled with a haze that just turns photos an ugly mushy colour.

BNSF 4050 is rolling down off Ash Hill toward Ludlow at line speed, 75 mph. The line climbs and curves around the lighter coloured hill to the left and in front of the darker one in the far background. Even at this time of day it's getting hot, just under 100°F here.

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This and a couple at Amboy was all that I picked up on the drive to Kingman.

Kingman as far as the Railroad is concerned is a town of two halves, the lower rocky (Kingman) canyon side and the upper more gentle sloped (Slaughterhous) canyon side. There's also two lines, the lower more steeply graded original line and the new ATSF high line.

BNSF 4865 rolls down the lower original line, at this point is a fairly gentle grade but behind the train the last mile is very steeply graded to bring it up to the same level as the high line at Kingman depot.

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On the high line BNSF 8175 brings a Z train up the hill.

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Looking up the grade near the top of the canyon the two lines are closing to meet up in Kingman.

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In less than ½ mile both lines will be at the same level as the high line, on the right a slow moving double stack is grinding up the grade, on the left a faster intermodal is overtaking it on the low line. Both line curve hard right in the middle distance. The centre of the photo is where I'd like to try and get some more photos, problem is access, there is none, so you end up parking here and leaving the rental unattended or parking in town and trying to cross one of the lines to get between them.

From the town end the curve and grade is fierce. BNSF 6241 is rolling down through Kingman depot on the original line and about to drop down the steep grade into the canyon.

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BNSF 4614 is in DPU mode and holding back the train as it drops over the edge and into the canyon. On the right that waste area looks like a good spot for head on shots coming up the old line.

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Moments later BNSF 5257 grinds out of the canyon on the high line and swings into the Kingman depot area, the low line can already be seen dropping off in the foreground.

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To the east is Slaughterhouse canyon, the original line is on the inside of the curve, the newer outer line is much wider and longer and as a result a longer more smoother grade.

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On the right a heavy intermodal climbs up the newer line, at this point they are pretty much the same elevation but the original line on the left soon drops very quickly into Kingman depot.

Another looking up the hill on the newer line. The grade is appreciable and from the crest it levels out past the airport and then begins the long less fierce climb up to Yampai summit 60 odd miles away. There's a nice location about 6-7 miles north of Kingman airport at Walapai where the uphill grade can be photographed well, it's on the bucket list.

Standing here as five GEVOs grind by less than 15' away is chest pounding loud, awesome! This and a couple of locations in the rocky canyon are some of the best sound track areas on the Transcon 2 that I've found, Cajon and Cosnino are two others.

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From the road bridge looking down grade we can see both lines.

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On the left the newer longer and less graded line, on the right the older steeper graded line, this has actually been slewed to the left to ease the curve and increase line speed, the original line can easily be seen to the right. The hills in the background and to the left are both on the list for some overall canyon shots this time around.
 
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Big Train James

Western Thunderer
Catching up on a few things here:

Mick, on the gp** step tread etch, in my experience the holes in the tread never go all the way to the ends. There may still be the little nubs all the way out, but the big holes usually stop short by at least the diameter of the hole, often more. If you revised your step in this manner, you wouldn't have an issue with the plastic tabs underneath.

I don't know where I got the following photo, so I can't attribute. It's some sort of early gp** loco, not sure which kind. And I can't guarantee that the steps are original. But the condition at the ends of the treads is what I would expect.
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Regarding truck tonnage ratings, I think the numbers are more or less nominal, rather than absolute. The other thing to remember is that the rating of the truck really describes the weight of the lading rather than the gross rail load. A car meant to carry 100 tons of lading would ride on 100 ton trucks, even though the GRL would be 263,000 pounds. Cars with a GRL of 286,000 would ride on 110 ton trucks and be intended to carry 110 ton of lading. The same rule of thumb applies to 70 ton and 125 ton cars/trucks, with GRL's of 220,000 and 315,000 pounds respectively.

Obviously the articulated well cars are a different arrangement, since each car is effectively only supported by 2 axles. Specifically to well cars, I found a document on the AAR website that identifies the load constraints for well cars, whether they be single cars, 3 unit sets, or 5 unit sets. The document falls into the "more than you'd ever want to know, unless it was your job" category, except for us train nerds of course :oops::rolleyes::cool:.

Jordan, there was a guy at the p48 meeting at the Chicago show that was passing around bottom and double shelf couplers. They are similar to the Protocraft coulplers, I believe they were brass castings. They are the same ones that have been teased as in development for several years now. I'm not especially interested in them for personal reasons, but they looked decent. Of course without my magnifying visor, I couldn't really see the details all that well :eek::confused: !

As an aside, but related to the double shelf couplers, the goal of preventing couplers from puncturing adjacent cars as a result of derailments is also why many of the newer tank cars designed for oil transport have shields around the ends of the tanks now. These ScaleTrains HO models include this detail.

All for now,
Jim
 

mickoo

Western Thunderer
Ok last ones to round out last years GV.

I ended up back where I started, Flagstaff and Cosnino. My first evening was spent here and so was my last morning, even though it's over 400 miles from LA it has more than enough appeal to make me want to, and will, go back this time again.

BNSF 5426 rolls down into Flagstaff depot before the final push up the last few miles to the summit at the continental divide.

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Cosnino, glorious morning and over a dozen trains before I left at lunch time.

First up BNSF 5346 grinds up the grade and into the shallow cutting which is just to the east of Cosnino grade crossing.

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A short while later BNSF 6354 rolls eastward and out of the cutting, already in dynamics holding back what eventually turned out to be a 12K stacker.

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BNSF 4004 is really making hard work of a massive tanker train, there were no mid train helpers, just rear end DPU's and one of them must of not been loading up correctly or BNSF had cut their HP/tonnage ratio a touch tight.

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Barely making 10 mph 4004 squeals past and into the cut.

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On the rear end two DPU's add to the splendor that is BNSF Transco2 at Cosnino.

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I've recently read that BNSF forbid run 8 mode in order to save fuel, engineers have to ask for control permission to advance to run 8 if they are having difficulties. It appears they prefer to struggle in run 7 and take longer than opt to increase to run 8.

Either way, run 7 or 8, it's still staggeringly loud and impressive.
 

Yorkshire Dave

Western Thunderer
BNSF 4004 is really making hard work of a massive tanker train, there were no mid train helpers, just rear end DPU's and one of them must of not been loading up correctly or BNSF had cut their HP/tonnage ratio a touch tight.

Seems to be a sign of the times - in ATSF days they knew how to run a railroad (as did the SP) and made sure they had plenty of HP for heavy trains.
 

Rob R

Western Thunderer
Flights and hotel all booked for my trip across the pond.
My free weekend "ball, squirrel, stick" conundrum has been complicated somewhat by a large juicy T-Bone steak being thrown into the ring.

The Southern California S-Gaugers Club are holding S Fest West on the 18th just a few miles down the road from my hotel.
Hmmm, I might have to think about that for a millisecond or two :D.

I still want to do the SCRM at Perris on the Sunday so, despite it's obvious attractions I think the sights and sounds of Cajon are going to lose out.
I'll just have to drool over Micks piccies like the rest of WT....

Rob
 

mickoo

Western Thunderer
Ok quick update as shattered, flights, transfers, rentals, driving etc and now the adrenaline has worn off.

Basically got to Cajon around 02:30 this morning, slept for an hour, maybe an extra half somewhere but out and about taking photos before the sun came up. A nice fog wall cloud came up the pass and stopped along highway 138, it ebbed and flowed back and forth.

In total easily over 50 trains today, busiest I've ever seen it, managed photos of over 30 or so, not counted them up yet, so here's a snap shot of the day, mostly around Mormon rocks.

First trade at bare minimum lighting, technically poor but shows the effect we were having. BNXF xxxx roars out from under Hgw 138.

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A short while later BNSF 6685 rolls down through Mormon rocks.

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There were a couple of other trains, one I chased to summit where it was perfect sunshine. Back at Hgw138 BNSF 6044 looms out of the fog bank.

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The day cleared up nicely until it heated up and that heat shimmer dust mugginess arrived, hopeless for telephoto shots so went wide to try and get some colour in. Looking down from of one of the rocky outcrops a whole selection of trains rolled by.

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Back to normal altitude as the haze developed.

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A nice UP down hill on the Palmdale cut off, nearly missed this one, just damaged to bail out of the rental and grab the shot.

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Back on the BNSF mains UP were exercising running rights...a lot. One of the better ones.

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Once the sun swung round it was time to checking in the motel, get squared away and pop back out for a few last shots. this tome from the other Mormon rock outcrop.

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And last one once the sun had gone behind the mountains.

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Apologies if the lighting and colours are out, tired and the lap top screen is the best to judge these sorts of thing.
 
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