SDCR (SDJR) High sided goods and cattle wagon, 1862

[Jon Nazareth]

After Dan's 'home', I'll be moving on to this wagon. Another 'different' looking one and it's just the way that I like them. The drawing that I have is dated 9th December 1862 when the company was called the Somerset and Dorset Central Railway and it should be an interesting build. The only real problem are those buffer housings. They are obviously two halves bolted together and that's where the problem lies. I just know that I will make a pigs ear trying to reproduce those lugs and so, I'm going to machine them up as if they were a full casting sans lugs, a shame but these things are sent to try us from time to time.
The construction will be in styrene with some brass angle to support those hoops.

Jon

 

[Spitfire2865]

3D printing the bufferstocks might allow you to get those lugs correctly.

 

[Jon Nazareth]

Trevor
Yes, that's an option but I'm not that keen on the stripes that need sanding back to get a decent finish. At this size, may be even more difficult.

Jon

 

[simond]

Jon,

I’ve just purchased a batch of Modelu figures in 7mm. They are 3D printed, I believe Alan uses a UV setting resin polymerised by a computer projector.

There is no sign whatever of the lines that are visible on other 3D products, however the material is not hard, it’s notably flexible, which is no disadvantage for figures.

As manufactured it might not be suitable for your buffer stocks, but I’m sure it would be fine for casting masters, to be made in whitemetal or resin from silicone moulds.

HTH
Simon

 

[Spitfire2865]

Trevor
Yes, that's an option but I'm not that keen on the stripes that need sanding back to get a decent finish. At this size, may be even more difficult.

Jon

Shapeways FUD and FED material is a great example of how 3D printing can be used for final parts and casting masters. Its a resin material with almost no stratification in the finished part. Ive got some L&Y buffers in the material that look great, but am still waiting on wood to get the project started.

 

[Jon Nazareth]

The first picture shows the axle boxes and buffers. I gave a lot of thought to the later because of the bolting webs and decided to make them up as best I could without the webs as if they had been cast in one. I did look for a picture of an alternative early buffer but no joy there. I was told that there could be something in Southern Wagons Vol 5 but, I didn't have a copy and didn't want to take the risk of buying one and being disappointed. It would have been better to have had the webs but I knew that that was beyond me and 3D printing would be an added cost. The buffer heads are brass turnings with two layers of Ebony veneer glued together and then epoxied on. The axle boxes are some of Mike Williams' with most of their appendages machined away and then small rings soldered onto their faces. I did at first think that the boxes had rounded off bases but on further inspection, they proved to be square.
The next picture shows the buffer heads/ebony machined up with a slight radius on their faces. I did think that that they may have spun of during machining operations but, as you can see, they stayed glued on. The buffers are fixed to their bases/styrene pads and then fixed to the headstock. The draw hook plates are also in place.
The final picture has one of the ends propped up on the frame to show the double thickness of boards on the lower section.

Jon

 

[Spitfire2865]

Very nice. I like the wood faced buffers.

 

[Jon Nazareth]

Just finished the basic sides and wanted to see what it was going to look like. The little round things are magnets holding up the side and end. I'm trying to do as much as I can in the flat, as there are so many bolt holes to drill, before final assembly. I was hoping for a delivery of ten thou thick Evergreen strip today needed to make some of the hinges et al out of...maybe the package will arrive tomorrow.

Jon

 

[Jon Nazareth]

I'm trying to sort out the hinges for both the upper and lower doors. If I'd looked at this drawing harder then I would have come to conclusion that that that angle iron (brass) 'strap', would have thrown the doors forward. As it is, I've made both sides flush, which means that the upper door hinges will have to cranked to fit around the angle iron. Also, the ones for the lower door will have to have the sticky out bit confused cranked to fit over the angle. All a bit of a pain but nothing that I can do now. The pictures show my attempts at making the hinges. My original idea for the upper doors was to make the knuckles out of brass and then silver solder these to the strap part. I did manage two but the knuckles on the others, and there are eight altogether, were 'pulled' over and on to the straps, not where I wanted them. One I managed to melt and another, I squashed trying to hold it in place. I did file a small flat on each of the knuckles to try and prevent the rolling action but to no avail. The flats show up in the first picture. My next idea was to make them from styrene using the same principal. This seemed to work but there wasn't much in the way of 'glue' holding them together and a couple fell apart when picked up. I re fixed these and then applied a tiny drop of super glue hopeing that it would add a bit of strength. After the holes are drilled in the straps, I'm going to super glue the knuckle, which will include part of the strap, to the angle iron and leave overnight. I'm then going to attempt to 'fold' the strap over the angle iron and then fix to the door. I'll be going for a right angle but, I suppose there's nothing wrong with a gentle slope. Does anyone have any thoughts on this or how they may have looked in prototype form?? I'm awaiting materials to make up the lower door hinges but this could take about three weeks as Eileen's have to re order and, I couldn't find anyone else who sold 3mm x 0.5mm brass or nickel strip which seemed strange to me. The hinges are the last big obstacle for me as the rest is almost there. As these early wagons only had the cast number plate for identification, (no transfers, hurrah!)I'll be painting it as soon as it's finished.

Jon

 

[oldravendale]

Jon - Hobby Holidays have 3mm x 0.5mm brass on their site - £1.95 for 305mm. See the last line on Hobby Holidays online shop

Brian

 

[lankytank]

Jon,

You're not looking in the right place....... Pauses, to put on his Metalsmith hat.......

When Mr Pavie gave up building G3 locos I obtained the material that he used for his boiler bands. Just measured it, 3mm wide x 15 thou thick (0.4mm ish). If you can be patient & wait 'til after the weekend, we can talk & perhaps I can supply a 'sample' for trials (if you get my drift........)

It'll have to be after the weekend - apparently, I've got a BIG birthday on Sunday & she's whisking me away for a weekend of jollifications - don't know what or where, it's Top Secret - but we're departing in about half an hour......... Hang on chaps, I'm going in..........

Baz

 

[lankytank]

Jon - Hobby Holidays have 3mm x 0.5mm brass on their site - £1.95 for 305mm. See the last line on

B*gg*r

I'm doing myself out of some dosh - I normally charge a £1.50 a foot...........

 

[Jon Nazareth]

Baz
I looked at Metalsmith but couldn't see it there. Obviously missed it or was it represented as a coil? If a coil, will it still come out flat?

Brian
No, I must admit, I didn't look at Hobby Hols .

Jon

 

[jamiepage]

I hope Barry doesn't find he has only been taken out for the Friday night shop.

Jon,
Is there any chance you could persevere with the silver soldered knuckle/ strap joints? Or even soft soldered?
Both bits could be well overlength while being soldered (eg inches, not millimetres) then trimmed to size after soldering.
It wouldn't matter if the round bit rolled up the strap (although less likely to happen if the bits are longer) because as long as the included angle held a small fillet of solder, the thing could be filed back to shape.
The only important thing would be to ensure the knuckle and straps remained perpendicular to each other during soldering. (Itself easier to achieve if the bits were both overlength).

I only really suggest it because the strength of a soldered joint might come in useful as you bend the straps to sit flat on the doors.

Jamie

 

[Overseer]

Don't forget this type of hinge would nearly always be tapered in thickness. You might need to find thicker material and file it to the taper.

 

[Jon Nazareth]

Jamie
Thanks for the suggestion but, as I've made up the styrene hinges already, I'm going to have a go with those first. I'm going to temporarily secure the brass angle with 16BA screws just in case the idea fails. I will at least be able to remove it for clean up purposes before it's back to the drawing board.

Overseer
Thanks for that bit of information and, I didn't know that. As you will see from above, I'm finding the hinges difficult enough as it is so, don't think that I'll be doing any tapering. All spoken in a friendly manner .
Would tapered straps be for just early stock?

Jon

 

[Overseer]

Thanks for that bit of information and, I didn't know that. As you will see from above, I'm finding the hinges difficult enough as it is so, don't think that I'll be doing any tapering. All spoken in a friendly manner .
Would tapered straps be for just early stock?

Jon

Sorry, I didn't mean to make things more difficult. It is just one of those details that once you have noticed it you tend to keep noticing, or I do. Tapered hinges were common while the ironwork was being made by blacksmiths, so up to WW2. There were also plenty of examples where they weren't tapered. I have been trying to think of good example photos I have on the computer but finding images clear enough is not that easy. One with tapered hinges is this Highland Railway 6 wheel open, originally built as a machinery wagon then used in the HR breakdown train -

Photo from the Highland Railway Society collection available on line at ww.ambaile.org.uk. Not a big difference in thickness but you can see it in the shadows.

I think the hinges on the cupboard doors on the G&SW wagon are constant thickness -


Your wagon will certainly be interesting and unusual when it is finished.

 

[Spitfire2865]

Also interestingly, the side knees were often tapered, but I dont know many who would bother.
The wagon is looking good. I love the barred "windows".

 

[Jon Nazareth]

Rain stopped play in the garden today so, I had a go at 'bending' these hinges. The knuckle end was glued in place with araldite. I did try super glue but it tended to run about a bit, you know what I mean. I left them over night and today pushed down with a squarely ground off needle file while applying a drop of mekpak, it worked fairly successfully. The only problem being that where the styrene bends over the edge of the brass angle, there was a tendency for some of the straps to split. I can't remember just how many but they aren't too bad. The lower hinges will be in brass and will need a bit of bending too but there shouldn't be any splitting. So, almost there with this one. The making and fitting of the lower hinges and the fitting of the main springs should see it finished, the latter are being cast especially. Oh, and the bending and fitting of the two hoops.
Baz
I had already paid for the brass from Eileen's so, I won't be taking you up on your kind offer.

Jon

 

[Jon Nazareth]

I tried to upload a bigger picture to show the hinges better but this is as good as I can make it.

Jon