7mm Birmingham Moor Street

Discussion in 'Layout Progress' started by Focalplane, 9 April 2019.

  1. Focalplane

    Focalplane Western Thunderer

    While fitting the sandbox mechanism I looked at the photo in the instructions and thought ‘whoever put that together really knows how to model’. Than I realised it was a photo of the real thing!

    The photo is visible in the image in the previous post, with the green paint.
  2. GrahameH

    GrahameH Western Thunderer

    You can never have enough Panniers !
    cbrailways likes this.
  3. Focalplane

    Focalplane Western Thunderer

    Beginning to look like a 64xx pannier

    Bags of castings to go before it’s done!
    Last edited: 4 December 2020
    Peter Cross, mickoo, Deano747 and 5 others like this.
  4. Focalplane

    Focalplane Western Thunderer

    The photo above reveals a small problem. I have used CA glue to attach the top of the panniers to the large white metal side pannier castings. Then I attached the chimney using solder and the nearby heat lifted the glued area away from the casting, on the left side. I can close the gap but it shows the risks involved of using the combination of glue and solder.

    However, the plus side is that the buffer bodies were soldered on using solder paste and my butane torch. Hardly any visible solder and none of it has yet been cleaned off. It’s the little improvements to my technique that provides so much inspiration to make these kits up into working models.
    LarryG, simond and oldravendale like this.
  5. simond

    simond Western Thunderer


    I fear that your CA will have left a crust on the two parts that will prevent it all sitting down nicely again, unless cleaned off thoroughly.

    let’s hope I’m wrong!

  6. Focalplane

    Focalplane Western Thunderer

    Yes, Simon, I agree. The solution will be to leave it until all soldering in the area is done and then re-glue. The gap can be closed with light finger pressure.
  7. SimonT

    SimonT Western Thunderer

    I know it's a little late but with mine I tinned the underside with three/four spots of solder on each side and then tacked it down onto the tanks/structure. 145 Solder, good amount of flux, very hot iron and in and out quickly, but let it cool between visits of the iron - you don't want a build up of heat. I use superglues less and less.

    Focalplane likes this.
  8. Focalplane

    Focalplane Western Thunderer

    Simon, good plan for next time. The huge white metal castings actually take a lot of heat, my butane torch was not too far away when heating the dome and chimney. It’s the small castings that can become a blob and MOK kits don’t have any of those!
  9. Focalplane

    Focalplane Western Thunderer

    A few of many parts added today while it rained, and rained

    Deano747, GrahameH, Alan and 4 others like this.
  10. mickoo

    mickoo Western Thunderer

    Coming along nicely :thumbs: good clean workmanship too.

    Sadly I didn't have a green field site when I did mine, it was a bring and buy bargain that turned out not to be, but after a lot of work it pitched up quite nicely.


    One thing that niggled the bejeezz out of me was the panel over the smoke box, out of the kit the chimney is plonked on top, in real life this is not so, in real life it's sat on the smokebox wrapper like a real engine; two half plates are then fitted over the top.


    I threw the kit part away, dropped in a new base plate set about 2 mm below the tanks, fitted the chimney then added the cover plates so that there was a small gap around the base.

    The firebox should be raised as well, that cover plate was trimmed back and a raised firebox section was fitted.


    Cover plates were tinned underneath with 145°C then a thin sliver of 100°C flashed in with the micro torch. You probably stand more risk of buckling the half etch tops than melting the white metal tanks to be honest.
    Podartist79, Alan, 3 LINK and 7 others like this.
  11. LarryG

    LarryG Western Thunderer

    Lovely engines. I would have a Lionheart but am not keen on the drive. Shame.
  12. mickoo

    mickoo Western Thunderer

    Quick Flickr trawl that might help with tank top details.

    [​IMG]GWR: 6430 6400 Class 0-6-0PT Ramsbottom (ELR) by emdjt42, on Flickr

    [​IMG]GWR 6400 No. 6430 by Peter, on Flickr

    [​IMG]GWR 6400 No. 6430 by Peter, on Flickr

    6430 has sloped cover plates either side of the firebox with hinged covers for the washout plug access, some engines are narrower and the plates sit flat making the firebox hump more evident, 6412 being a case in example, flat plates with domed access covers.

    Click the links and then view the images are much larger sizes.

    One thing I have just noticed in that last image is that the top lamp bracket is also attached directly to the smokebox wrapper, a small slot in the cover has been cut around it. I've also seen them attached directly on top too.
    Last edited: 5 December 2020
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  13. mickoo

    mickoo Western Thunderer

    The MOK kit is a little fiddly in places, more so when you have to take it apart, clean it all up and rebuild. But it does build into a very very nice model and you could easily go to town on the frames and super detail them inside......if one was so inclined of course ;)

    Put another way, you don't have to go backward to go forward like you do with some other kits :p

    I'm not a Pannier fan and mine was just 'another job' but at the end I will concede that it did look good.
    Podartist79, 3 LINK and Focalplane like this.
  14. Focalplane

    Focalplane Western Thunderer

    Thanks for such nice comments, I am slowly getting to understand how to build kits!

    I really like MOK’s kits but I do find the complexity a bit taxing at times. My 14xx tank engine was easier to build and runs so sweetly I can’t believe I built it! The top of the boiler and panniers is indeed awkward but I will be pleased just to get it looking OK at this moment in time.

    3 LINK and Pencarrow like this.
  15. Focalplane

    Focalplane Western Thunderer

    Some middle of the night research reminded me that the 64xx pannier will actually be a 74xx, the freight version without autotrain equipment. That will mean a few less brass castings need to be fitted.

    Why 74xx? I have evidence that they worked local freight through Snow Hill, probably between Hockley and Bordesley yards. The small driving wheels were no doubt appreciated when approaching the Snow Hill tunnel from the south east, having to transfer from the relief Down to main Down just before the 1:45 incline through the tunnel.

    Here is 7424 on a Down freight.

    Birmingham Snow Hill - British Railways Period Locomotives: Ex-GWR 0-6-0PT 74xx class No 7424 is seen passing through Birmingham Snow Hill on 23rd November 1963

    Somewhere in my stash I have plates for 7433.
    Last edited: 6 December 2020
  16. simond

    simond Western Thunderer

    I acquired one from the G0G Gazette small ads some years back. It’s not done a great deal of running but it seems sweet enough. I suppose if it falls over, I’ll have to sort it but not a bridge I’ll worry about for the time being.

    3 LINK likes this.
  17. LarryG

    LarryG Western Thunderer

    Perhaps I was too harsh on the RTR 64xx's. I like the class so much that I am bound to succumb to another when the layout is up and running. On 'tother hand, gimme a 16xx anyday! You can't have enough Panniers...
    WEB GWR Panniers.jpg
    Last edited: 6 December 2020
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  18. Focalplane

    Focalplane Western Thunderer

    I have been away from the workbench for several days as the weather, though cold, has at least been mostly dry. What I have done is to take the body of the pannier and try to fit it on its chassis! Not surprisingly it needed some work, mostly filing down the chassis rear to fit into the body. Now it is a very tight fit but the three screw holes line up and the chassis runs OK. However, I have no wire suitable to rig up the 12 volt DC controller to my fledgling test track (2 yards of bullhead on the window shelf) to check for any shorts.

    My hands are aching due to a severe bout of pruning in the overgrown garden we bought as a challenge! Ivy is not my best friend. So any delicate work is off limits for a day or two. It looks like gardening will be curtailed anyway as rain is forecast over the next few days. So more brass fittings will be added.


    PhilH, 3 LINK and LarryG like this.
  19. LarryG

    LarryG Western Thunderer

    The Pannier is coming along nicely. Racing ahead a bit, which livery will you choose?
  20. Focalplane

    Focalplane Western Thunderer

    Thanks, Larry

    Yes, racing ahead I have to say as a lowly freight engine it will probably be all black with early BR “crest”. I really don’t remember seeing any green tank engines, never mind those that may have been lined out. Them’s were dirty days around Brum unless top link and based at Stafford Road or Bushbury. For colourful locos I went to Tamworth!

    The Bushbury Joobs were the best turned out locos in the region

    Birmingham New Street Station - BR Period Locomotives: Ex-LMS 5XP 4-6-0 No 45647 'Sturdee' is seen about to enter Worcester Street tunnel at the head of the up 'Midlander' to Euston

    But over the other side of town there was competition

    Birmingham Snow Hill - British Railways Period Locomotives: Ex-GWR 4-6-0 King class No 6002 'King William IV' is seen arriving at Platform 7 whilst at the head of the 7 20am Pwllheli to Paddington service on 12th August 1961

    The best I can do for Tamworth is this, a signed print of which hangs in the railway room

    Warwickshire Railways Art - Philip Hawkins FGRA - Ex-LMS Royal Scot 4-6-0 No. 46132 ' The King's Regiment Liverpool ' thundering through Low Level station with the down 'Red Rose'
    LarryG likes this.