7mm US model dabblings

mickoo

Western Thunderer
Mick,
One of the things I'd like to find is information on the disposition of SP units after they've been sold off. I've already gone through all the SP switcher photos on several of the usual photo sites, and also a good number of UP photos as well. If I could figure out where units landed, I might be able to find other photos.
It looks like most are still on UP books, though I'm not sure how up to date this guy keeps his records, I've always thought it was pretty accurate, but I might be wrong.

 

mickoo

Western Thunderer
The above list is a bit more complex than I first imagined, it only shows dispositions of engines whilst under SP ownership, not what happens to them in the future.

To do that you have to click on the individual engine number, not so bad in this case as we're only talking maybe 60-70 or so that remained on UP books.

An example from the SP list above (SP 2638) opening that page


That'll give the details for that specific engine, at the top it gives all other engines with this serial and we find LTEX, UPY and SWP in chronological order. The LTEX is I believe whilst under SP/DRGW ownership, the company was so cash strapped that maintenance was stopped on all but critical main line power. The switchers were sold to lease companies who overhauled them and then leased back to SP/DRG whilst retaining the same running number.

SP 2638 then became UPY 1204, if you select that you get a bunch of images under that road number, it was then sold off to SWP and renumbered back to it's original SP number, 2638.

Interestingly, SWP owned two SW1500's both Ex SP units, the other was SP 2627 which appears to have been bought direct from SP as no UP number is allocated, it then went on to LTEX, NREX and finally ARC 9. Though no dates are given for the changes of ownership you can get a rough idea of dates from the photos.

It looks like SWP picked up 2638 first in 2006 and then two years later swapped it out for 2627.

It's a lot of back and forth but you should be able to work out the disposition of all the SP SW1500 fleet from these pages.
 

Big Train James

Western Thunderer
Mick,
RRpicturearchives.net is one of my go-to photo sites. It's interesting how much information is now available there now. I don't really remember things like the serial numbers being available for all or most locos, nor as many bits of info in the header up top. I will have to take a look based on the "other units with this serial" link. I will say that I don't think the "other units" list is chronological, there are plenty of other instances where things are out of order.

LTEX is Larry's Truck and Electric, a loco rebuilder and lessor located not too far from here. They have yards (here and here)full of old locos and parts, many of which I have strong interest in. Unfortunately I don't get the impression that they welcome visitors, which is a shame. I could get lost for weeks in there.

I also don't think that the LTEX ex-SP units were sold and then leased back. I know that SP did that with rolling stock, under the guise of the Golden West Service reporting marks. But I've never heard of that being done with the locos as well. But then I also can't say definitely that it didn't happen either. So I'm not sure what my point is!:oops::rolleyes::)
 

mickoo

Western Thunderer
James,

To confirm Strathpacs notes, in the mid 80's maintenance was so bad that the SP sold road units to lessors who refurbished them and leased them back to SP, switchers were not maintained and were driven into the ground. My mistake was to assume the LTEX SW1500 were part of that agreement, there's no indication in Strathpac that occurred.

By 1988 the situation was so bad that the new DRGW board acted and a 'few' (numbers are not given) were overhauled at Houston (Sacramento shops had closed by then) to keep them going. Sixteen of those received speed lettering but the rest are not noted.

That second link looks like an open industrial unit site, there appears to be lines of engines alongside a public road, crawling all over them wouldn't be possible but you might get away with walking along the path taking pictures, well I might and play the 'tourist card' if approached.

Hard to believe that nine of UP's gensets are stacked up there as well, they can't be that old, i thought Gensets were the new future, but seeing these all junked up at the back of the site suggests not.
 
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Big Train James

Western Thunderer
Unfortunately, the second location is a fenced and gated business park. Not necessarily gated as in guardhouse level security. But probably signed as private property. One of these days when I'm over that way, I'm going to make a point of driving by to see exactly what the situation is.

I have fantasies of going to the front and politely asking for permission to go in and take photos and measurements. Regrettably, in similar circumstances elsewhere, everybody always says no to me. It's bad for my self esteem, I must project a very off-putting personality.:(:(:(

The gensets were the way of the future when the railroads were receiving grant money or tax breaks for using them. I've never heard them described as anything more than adequate for purpose, and more often as maintenance headaches that were frequently out of service. It doesn't surprise me at all that UP would jettison them as soon as the financial benefit they provided expired.

UPY 2005 was the first genset prototype. I've always had plans to model it, since I like oddball things. It also helps that the prototype is built on an ex-mp15dc frame, so I could use the Atlas model as a starting point. I'm still interested in it, but less so than in the past, as I'm more interested in the ordinary these days.
 
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Scale7JB

Western Thunderer
All this modern US diesel stuff is way over my head, even the early stuff is if I'm to be brutally honest.

However, i find it very funny that these Genset switchers you mention are still using the F unit Blomberg(?) bogies.

JB.
 

mickoo

Western Thunderer
All this modern US diesel stuff is way over my head, even the early stuff is if I'm to be brutally honest.

However, i find it very funny that these Genset switchers you mention are still using the F unit Blomberg(?) bogies.

JB.
Why not, it's a good design and tough as nails, there's been a few (three?) evolution's but you have to look hard or know what to look for to spot them, a casual observer probably wouldn't know.

Blombergs first came out in 1939 on the FT's and has been going ever since, a lot of modern engines ride on trade in trucks from previous builds, I wouldn't be surprised if there are trucks still kicking around from early days, maybe not the FT's but later F7 or F9 units or maybe GP-9's.

Trucks were/are one of the prime items recovered from scrap units, SCL (Seaboard Coast Line) traded in Geeps or F units Blombergs and had them fitted to GE new U30B units, they did the same again ten years later with the BQ23-7 builds. The only other Railroad I've found so far that did the same was the Western Pacific (WP) on an order of U23B's.

I have a small folder I stuff these oddities in when I find them, they'd make a nice project, especially given the Atlas RTR Blomberg trucks or even the Atlas/Roco option availability.
 

Big Train James

Western Thunderer
Some of the GE b23-7 super series locos had Blombergs. I think the demonstrators had them, and I know that the Monongahela units had them. Those went to Conrail, then to CSX, and then Genesee & Wyoming. The Ohio Central G&W subsidiary uses them in southeastern Ohio. Three different schemes.......

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It also went the other way, there are EMD units with trade-in Alco or GE AAR road trucks. I know the Soo had gp30's or 35's so equipped, and there were at least a couple of other roads that did the same.

Diesel Era, Volume 10 Issue 1, Jan/Feb 1999 has articles on both the u23b and the b23-7.
 
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JasonD

Western Thunderer
JB, my tables at Stokenchurch on Sunday will have a few books - not the current Morning Sun (terrific) photo+ albums, but old: SP steam, amazing quality pics from large-format negs AND, much more important for you, a copy of a classic 'The Diesel Spotters Guide'. I didn't become the man I am today without getting jeans with pockets big enough to fit this in.

The Maine Central U18Bs (I didn't know that their Independence Class included one named after the West Sussex town where one of my girlfriend's dad worked) were delivered with GE factory reconditioned Blombergs:
Hmmm, circular saw to take out 4 tall hood doors, etc and a bit of fuel tank from that Lionel U30C...! Atlas/Roco F9 for power!

I will have a steamer or two and I promise I don't just mean mugs of tea.
Jason
 

Scale7JB

Western Thunderer
JB, my tables at Stokenchurch on Sunday will have a few books - not the current Morning Sun (terrific) photo+ albums, but old: SP steam, amazing quality pics from large-format negs AND, much more important for you, a copy of a classic 'The Diesel Spotters Guide'. I didn't become the man I am today without getting jeans with pockets big enough to fit this in.

The Maine Central U18Bs (I didn't know that their Independence Class included one named after the West Sussex town where one of my girlfriend's dad worked) were delivered with GE factory reconditioned Blombergs:
Hmmm, circular saw to take out 4 tall hood doors, etc and a bit of fuel tank from that Lionel U30C...! Atlas/Roco F9 for power!

I will have a steamer or two and I promise I don't just mean mugs of tea.
Jason
Thanks Jason, It would be interesting to see, but living in a flat with very limited space prevents me from collecting books (and models) that aren't exactly what I'm after or need.... sadly.

I guess also, I'm more into the steam than the diesel however, the Diesel aspect will really add to the overall look on the final project. Just need a house, with space!

JB.
 

mickoo

Western Thunderer
If the SP steam book isn't one I've already got then I'll certainly be interested :thumbs:

Do you have any SP Gyralite castings by any chance.
 

mickoo

Western Thunderer
Some of the GE b23-7 super series locos had Blombergs. I think the demonstrators had them, and I know that the Monongahela units had them. Those went to Conrail, then to CSX, and then Genesee & Wyoming. The Ohio Central G&W subsidiary uses them in southeastern Ohio. Three different schemes.......

View attachment 155597
View attachment 155598
View attachment 155599

It also went the other way, there are EMD units with trade-in Alco or GE AAR road trucks. I know the Soo had gp30's or 35's so equipped, and there were at least a couple of other roads that did the same.

Diesel Era, Volume 10 Issue 1, Jan/Feb 1999 has articles on both the u23b and the b23-7.
I'd forgotten about those, I've only managed to find a few shots (mind I haven't searched in earnest truth be told) and skimmed past them when browsing what I did have late last night. They look good in CSX YN3 scheme :thumbs:
 

JasonD

Western Thunderer
If the SP steam book isn't one I've already got then I'll certainly be interested :thumbs:

Do you have any SP Gyralite castings by any chance.
I'll do the usual at the Meet, say Hi and more to all the fellow lockdowners, take pics of stuff coming out of boxes the Post-it notes have fallen off and make a multi-column list of books (inc. SP) where people then ask: is that the early version by George Hamilton IV??
Jason
 

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mickoo

Western Thunderer
Jason,

My bad, I meant these SP Gyralites, I would like some of those brass ones in the first picture, even if it's just to scale off and 3D print more for future planned locos.

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Failing having the above, I'll throw the request open to the hive, a decent drawing with some basic dimensions on.
 

mickoo

Western Thunderer
I had a nice little natter today at the NMRABR show, felt strange to be that side of the trade table :cool:

I picked up a few bits and pieces, some nice niche interest books, a bundle of decals, mostly tank cars, which if I opt for a industrial layout will form a larger portion of the stock; however, after today, it's not a given the bat cave layout will even be O gauge, it's a big space for a N gauge Donner/Cajon pass type layout.

Stock wise, I added another RC GP9 kit to the stash and picked up some more Import brass which was a bit of a mix and match and only one item in it's original box.

I'm fairly confident the steamer is a PSC T-28, there's no makers label and no original box, separately it came with a Division Point 90-R-1 tender, which is in it's original box and has a etched label underneath.

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The other item was a SP tender minus a truck, again no markings but painted and lettered, not factory as some of it is wonky, highly unlikely it's factory applied, there is a brass label underneath but whoever painted this covered it with black paint and it's not an etched label but screen printed, what ever was written there is long gone.

It's been marked up for a SP C class and from a bit of sleuthing should be a 100-C-x (x = could be 1,2,3 batch and I've not defined which one) and both PSC T class offerings (T-28 & T-31) ship with a 100-C tender.

My hunch is that this tender should be matched to the engine, it makes no odds because both tenders ran with both classes.

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Either way, the engine will have a tender and I have the other as spare to go with the 3rd Rail UP 90C tender. I need to now try and track down a spare PSC 120-C tender truck, reasonably confident they do them as spares or in kit form and tender trucks come frequently on Ebay now and again, it'll probably need a strip down as the lettering not being straight niggles me.
 
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mickoo

Western Thunderer
Not sure I’ve chatted with anyone that intensely for that long for quite a while.

Good to catch up though!

JB.
You're a very good listener :))

It was all mostly US railroads so very nice to have a good conversation with like minded people. It would have been nice if there was more O gauge but the two HO layouts were good and I was taken by how small the stock looked having been focused entirely on O gauge for many recent years.

Those box car kits are not where I thought they were, so I'll have a good rummage around once I move stuff into the new bat cave (4-5 weeks hopefully) when it's finished.

MD
 

Scale7JB

Western Thunderer
You're a very good listener :))

It was all mostly US railroads so very nice to have a good conversation with like minded people. It would have been nice if there was more O gauge but the two HO layouts were good and I was taken by how small the stock looked having been focused entirely on O gauge for many recent years.

Those box car kits are not where I thought they were, so I'll have a good rummage around once I move stuff into the new bat cave (4-5 weeks hopefully) when it's finished.

MD
Absolutely no rush, and please put P48 wheels to one side too. ;)

JB.
 

JasonD

Western Thunderer
Sorry readers, post #106 on Poor Man's Alamosa is about standard gauge P48 wheels, etc. My lack of knowledge about Colorado railroading might stop you looking....
Jason
 
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