W1 as rebuilt
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- 7mm djh finney7 kit design lner martin finney
mickoo
Western Thunderer
Ok moving swiftly on, the first thing I need is a large 'flat' piece of brass for the footplate.normally I'd just do this next step behind the scenes but with all the recent chat about rolling bars I thought I'd expand a bit more on this.
Brass is usually shipped in coils, when you buy it from where ever they either flatten it or it is flattened by whoever supplies them, either way since it has been coiled and may well have been coiled warm off the press, or even the fact that is is rolled tightly, will generate heat and give the brass a natural bias to coiling, sometimes when re-heated with a soldering iron.
Anyway, needing a piece just over 320mm long means that the standard stock of A4 sheets will not suffice, so out comes the reserve from under the desk. I am fortunate that my 1:1 job requires working with this stuff on a reasonably regular occurrence (motor & gearbox bed shimming), and after big jobs there is always some left over
This was the smallest piece I could find, no point being greedy
First job is to scribe the cut mark and use a skrawker to cut through enough so that you can easily bend a piece off. The flattening process will leave wastage so needing 320mm I cut off 350mm
Mmmm Banana
Still, not a problem, out with the rollers and stuff it in upside down, we're going to flatten, or more correctly reverse roll.
The side with the tape marks is the outside and I simply adjust the top roller so that I can easily feed the piece through with it's natural curl.
Having done that I simply apply top roller pressure a bit at a time and hey presto the piece will begin to flatten, however, I carry on and apply even more pressure to make a complete reverse curl, now I know that the piece has been curled equally both ways and that should ease the stresses in the material.
Having reversed the curl I then slacken the top roller off, flip the material over and start the process again, but this time as it gets near to being flat I stop adding pressure, eventually it will become quite flat.
At this stage I flip the material over and run it through again without adjusting the top roller, you will find that one way it'll come out flat, the other way it'll curl....back to it's rolled state.... so I just keep going over and over until it rolls flat both ways, then your pretty sure it's stress free and ready for use. As this is just a test piece I just ran it through half a dozen times or so, but if it was something that had to be really flat like frames or footplates I'd run it through twenty or so times.
I probably don't have to go through all this malarky but I find it works for me and I usually have a nice flat and stable piece of material.
You can see that each end has a little kick in it, you can work this out, but I always cut this bit off as it hasn't been through the rollers fully as its the bit that drops between the rollers at the start and finish. You could use a backing material but trimming 15mm off each end is easier, it wont go to waste as it can be used for smaller parts of the model.
Y'all may already know all this, so apologies for the egg sucking exercise
Next up a rough cut of the basic footplate shape and trimming to fit the chassis and body.
Brass is usually shipped in coils, when you buy it from where ever they either flatten it or it is flattened by whoever supplies them, either way since it has been coiled and may well have been coiled warm off the press, or even the fact that is is rolled tightly, will generate heat and give the brass a natural bias to coiling, sometimes when re-heated with a soldering iron.
Anyway, needing a piece just over 320mm long means that the standard stock of A4 sheets will not suffice, so out comes the reserve from under the desk. I am fortunate that my 1:1 job requires working with this stuff on a reasonably regular occurrence (motor & gearbox bed shimming), and after big jobs there is always some left over
This was the smallest piece I could find, no point being greedy
First job is to scribe the cut mark and use a skrawker to cut through enough so that you can easily bend a piece off. The flattening process will leave wastage so needing 320mm I cut off 350mm
Mmmm Banana
Still, not a problem, out with the rollers and stuff it in upside down, we're going to flatten, or more correctly reverse roll.
The side with the tape marks is the outside and I simply adjust the top roller so that I can easily feed the piece through with it's natural curl.
Having done that I simply apply top roller pressure a bit at a time and hey presto the piece will begin to flatten, however, I carry on and apply even more pressure to make a complete reverse curl, now I know that the piece has been curled equally both ways and that should ease the stresses in the material.
Having reversed the curl I then slacken the top roller off, flip the material over and start the process again, but this time as it gets near to being flat I stop adding pressure, eventually it will become quite flat.
At this stage I flip the material over and run it through again without adjusting the top roller, you will find that one way it'll come out flat, the other way it'll curl....back to it's rolled state.... so I just keep going over and over until it rolls flat both ways, then your pretty sure it's stress free and ready for use. As this is just a test piece I just ran it through half a dozen times or so, but if it was something that had to be really flat like frames or footplates I'd run it through twenty or so times.
I probably don't have to go through all this malarky but I find it works for me and I usually have a nice flat and stable piece of material.
You can see that each end has a little kick in it, you can work this out, but I always cut this bit off as it hasn't been through the rollers fully as its the bit that drops between the rollers at the start and finish. You could use a backing material but trimming 15mm off each end is easier, it wont go to waste as it can be used for smaller parts of the model.
Y'all may already know all this, so apologies for the egg sucking exercise
Next up a rough cut of the basic footplate shape and trimming to fit the chassis and body.
oldravendale
Western Thunderer
Thanks Mickoo. I fully understand the process now.
Brian
Brian
mickoo
Western Thunderer
Moving glacially onward, real life etc!
The basic footplate is now fitted.
Into this will be cut the motor openings and other sundry things, already I can see a couple of issues with the splasher lengths, not surprising as when you look at the GA closely you can see where they are supposed to end, just need to tweak the art work to suit and then add some extra stays to allow the chassis to be bolted to the footplate.
Body test fit.
Doesn't look much but it takes time to blend the body curve to match the foot plate, a small gap is permissible as there's an overlay and reinforcing strip to go on the footplate so this will cover a small gap. Still more time needed to get the curve just so, once I'm happy with that I'll start measuring up for the fixings and cab area sheet work. I'll do a trial art work printed on A4 paper and pasted to a scrap piece of 0.010" to make sure all the angles....angle in the right places.
Broadside drivers side
Taking a bit of the body out over the intermediate driver and fire box rear will drop the body low enough to recover most of that gap up front I hope.
Broadside firemans side.
Again a little trimming over the intermediate driver should make it all sit a bit better.
Front view.
Not too shabby at this stage, most of the chassis fits reasonably well with the body.
Anyway, onward, time to adjust the chassis artwork with what I've found so far.....before I forget what was needed to make it all fit
The basic footplate is now fitted.
Into this will be cut the motor openings and other sundry things, already I can see a couple of issues with the splasher lengths, not surprising as when you look at the GA closely you can see where they are supposed to end, just need to tweak the art work to suit and then add some extra stays to allow the chassis to be bolted to the footplate.
Body test fit.
Doesn't look much but it takes time to blend the body curve to match the foot plate, a small gap is permissible as there's an overlay and reinforcing strip to go on the footplate so this will cover a small gap. Still more time needed to get the curve just so, once I'm happy with that I'll start measuring up for the fixings and cab area sheet work. I'll do a trial art work printed on A4 paper and pasted to a scrap piece of 0.010" to make sure all the angles....angle in the right places.
Broadside drivers side
Taking a bit of the body out over the intermediate driver and fire box rear will drop the body low enough to recover most of that gap up front I hope.
Broadside firemans side.
Again a little trimming over the intermediate driver should make it all sit a bit better.
Front view.
Not too shabby at this stage, most of the chassis fits reasonably well with the body.
Anyway, onward, time to adjust the chassis artwork with what I've found so far.....before I forget what was needed to make it all fit
mickoo
Western Thunderer
Well, bit of a slog really, 1:1 work is hell, getting home knackered and not 'feeling' CAD like at all!
Still, the first task was to get the footplate to fix to the body in a reliable and repeatable way, so some cutting and bending to make a couple of tabs results in the below. I may change the way the front one is located, bent, and move, re-cut the piece between the front and intermediate drivers.
There's a couple of fixing locations to be marked up yet to secure the chassis to the footplate and these will have to wait until the MkII chassis arrives back from the etchers and is made up.
It could do with another up front behind the buffer beam but the material isn't thick enough for a screw, so some sort of ledge may have to be fabricated, either to hold a screw fixing or form a slot to hold the footplate in place.
Having succeeded in getting the footplate fixed it was onto the cab several renditions later we arrive at something that fits and lines up at all the places it's supposed to line up.
I noticed earlier that there appeared to be some discrepancies between the drawing measurements for the cab and on the model, with a small gap between the cab and boiler casting, I'm pleased to say these were unfounded once the test pieces were dropped into place, something to do with compound angles and trig
I found some suitably thick 0.015" cardboard (Morrisons Fajita meal) and pasted the template on, next step is to paste onto brass and carefully cut it out and affix to the footplate. Once I'm happy with that then the sub floor needs measuring and drawing up and the cab roof.
Once I have those test pieces measured, fitted and aligned that'll be 80% of the cab structure sorted, the other 20% is the detail work, artwork layout and sending off to the etchers.
There's still some tweaking to do on the body casting to make it fit the footplate perfectly, red circle in the second image, a small gap is okay as there's a 0.010" overlay to go onto the footplate to give the lip above the valance and then another thin 0.010" strip along the footplate at the base of the boiler lagging to complete those details.
I also need to cut out the lubricator opening in the footplate, once that's done and the chassis fixing sorted I can draw up that part of the art work and sort out the final details of the footplate.
Still, the first task was to get the footplate to fix to the body in a reliable and repeatable way, so some cutting and bending to make a couple of tabs results in the below. I may change the way the front one is located, bent, and move, re-cut the piece between the front and intermediate drivers.
There's a couple of fixing locations to be marked up yet to secure the chassis to the footplate and these will have to wait until the MkII chassis arrives back from the etchers and is made up.
It could do with another up front behind the buffer beam but the material isn't thick enough for a screw, so some sort of ledge may have to be fabricated, either to hold a screw fixing or form a slot to hold the footplate in place.
Having succeeded in getting the footplate fixed it was onto the cab several renditions later we arrive at something that fits and lines up at all the places it's supposed to line up.
I noticed earlier that there appeared to be some discrepancies between the drawing measurements for the cab and on the model, with a small gap between the cab and boiler casting, I'm pleased to say these were unfounded once the test pieces were dropped into place, something to do with compound angles and trig
I found some suitably thick 0.015" cardboard (Morrisons Fajita meal) and pasted the template on, next step is to paste onto brass and carefully cut it out and affix to the footplate. Once I'm happy with that then the sub floor needs measuring and drawing up and the cab roof.
Once I have those test pieces measured, fitted and aligned that'll be 80% of the cab structure sorted, the other 20% is the detail work, artwork layout and sending off to the etchers.
There's still some tweaking to do on the body casting to make it fit the footplate perfectly, red circle in the second image, a small gap is okay as there's a 0.010" overlay to go onto the footplate to give the lip above the valance and then another thin 0.010" strip along the footplate at the base of the boiler lagging to complete those details.
I also need to cut out the lubricator opening in the footplate, once that's done and the chassis fixing sorted I can draw up that part of the art work and sort out the final details of the footplate.
mickoo
Western Thunderer
Nearly there now on the cab, all the test pieces printed and cut out in brass fit where they fit, just need to arrange the art work and add the detail bits before sending off for printing.
Its not the correct tender but it is handy to make sure everything lines up and stops the eye from making false impressions about cab roofs angles etc. 
The MkII chassis was in the etch queue last week and should be back early next week for the test build and instruction writing.
Its not the correct tender but it is handy to make sure everything lines up and stops the eye from making false impressions about cab roofs angles etc. The MkII chassis was in the etch queue last week and should be back early next week for the test build and instruction writing.
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warren haywood
Western Thunderer
Is it me or is something missing
Seriously tho that's brilliant stuff
Seriously tho that's brilliant stuff
mickoo
Western Thunderer
Windows? Couldn't be bothered to cut them all out, no need really as they will be done on the art work, all I need for this test is to make sure the sides and V front are the right shapes and fit the casting, then make sure that once the roof is rolled it's the right size and fits the cab.Is it me or is something missing
Seriously tho that's brilliant stuff
I suppose I could stick the paper templates on, that might make it look a bit better
Here's the artwork so far not really a lot to show for all the hours working out all the bits and tabs. All the major large bits are done, just need to flesh out the dias under the seats and the rest is all detail work. I hope to have the cab finished by the end of next week, so long as 1:1 work plays ball.
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mickoo
Western Thunderer
It's a Marmite thingVery tasty, even if it an ugly brute to my eye
mickoo
Western Thunderer
Well the MkII chassis arrived today, not bad, not bad at all, only two very small errors, one of which will require a fix on the cab etch, the other is forgettable as it's deep inside the frames and virtually invisible once built up, even if viewed dead beetle style.
Now comes the long tedious test build with instructions and photos
Now comes the long tedious test build with instructions and photos
mickoo
Western Thunderer
And then there were two
About half way through the build and instruction writing, hopefully done by the end of the weekend.
Sadly there will have to be a supplementary sheet (currently about 100 x 100 mm) to correct a few errors, apart from one total failure the others are tweaks to make construction easier. The supplementary sheet will go off for etching next week and once it's checked on it's return then the frames are done and dusted.
After that the cab will go off and soon after the footplate and valances etc, leaving only the bogie, pony and Cartazzi moving parts, valve gear and sundries like brake hangers and stretchers.
About half way through the build and instruction writing, hopefully done by the end of the weekend.
Sadly there will have to be a supplementary sheet (currently about 100 x 100 mm) to correct a few errors, apart from one total failure the others are tweaks to make construction easier. The supplementary sheet will go off for etching next week and once it's checked on it's return then the frames are done and dusted.
After that the cab will go off and soon after the footplate and valances etc, leaving only the bogie, pony and Cartazzi moving parts, valve gear and sundries like brake hangers and stretchers.
Nick Dunhill
Western Thunderer
Sir, You are truly a genius. Sorry was out of the loop, just catching up a bit post-holiday. Looking forward to getting it all back. On with the tenders at the moment.
Nick
Nick
mickoo
Western Thunderer
I've been called many things, cannot ever recall 'genius' being among them
Ok finally finished the second test build, well all that is required for the instructions which are also finished.
A few errors in some parts which require a supplementary sheet, the art work for this will get finalized tomorrow and off to the etchers first thing next week, once back and the parts checked then that'll be the frame art work all finished, couple of weeks hopefully.
The instructions are a combination of text and detailed photos, the parts will be supplied with a large colour A3 sheet of the etch numbering and a full colour copy of the instructions.
W1 instructions by Mickoo737, on FlickrTo save wading through the instructions, parts in red have had a visit from Captain cock up and his merry band of men, other than 78 and 84 which are totally unusable, the rest can be used with a little effort and swearing, but when the other 95% is perfect then the last 5% should be too.
This'll be the format I'll use for the rest of this project and the others in the pipeline.
https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/106218673/W1 instructions.pdf
mickoo
Western Thunderer
Cheers chaps, the instructions will also be available in pdf format on line for those who like that sort of thing.
Moving swiftly onward the supplementary sheet is complete, nowt much too it but it's show below for completeness.
These have been sent off to the etchers and thoughts now turn to finishing the cab and working out the footplate etc, not sure yet whether to add the option of full valances, the original concept was just for a BR machine, but it does look quite dashing in LNER Garter Blue. The only problem is they will take a lot of real estate up on the sheet.
Moving swiftly onward the supplementary sheet is complete, nowt much too it but it's show below for completeness.
These have been sent off to the etchers and thoughts now turn to finishing the cab and working out the footplate etc, not sure yet whether to add the option of full valances, the original concept was just for a BR machine, but it does look quite dashing in LNER Garter Blue. The only problem is they will take a lot of real estate up on the sheet.
mickoo
Western Thunderer
Moving on, cab artwork pretty much done, just a few small items like seats, brackets, fall plate and internal window frames to fit on, then it's onto the boundaries, tabs, hatching and cleaning up the layout. There's quite a few largish fiddly bits which leave a lot of space, but it all fits onto the minimum size PPD offer so the cost is as cheap as it gets. Hopefully wrap it all up tomorrow and send to PPD next week.
All the best
MD
All the best
MD
mickoo
Western Thunderer
Ok, cab artwork finished, a few extras added like seats, internal window frames and washout plugs for the boiler, I'm reasoning that some may be using the Hachette body with suitable modifications, which means the cast washout plugs will be removed during that process, so replacements are added here for their use.
The roof vents are designed to be openable if assembled with care and the internal frames should hold the glazing in place and allow the rear one to slide, only problem is the glazing will need a wooden painted edge adding to look right. No matter how hard I wrestled with it to make it from NS, trap the glazing, make it slide able and near scale thickness it just was not to be I'm afraid.
It has already been hatched and flipped for the rear art work and sits, complete and ready waiting for PPD to get back to me with the previous work and questions, must be post Xmas backlog.
Footplate next.
All the best
MD
The roof vents are designed to be openable if assembled with care and the internal frames should hold the glazing in place and allow the rear one to slide, only problem is the glazing will need a wooden painted edge adding to look right. No matter how hard I wrestled with it to make it from NS, trap the glazing, make it slide able and near scale thickness it just was not to be I'm afraid.
It has already been hatched and flipped for the rear art work and sits, complete and ready waiting for PPD to get back to me with the previous work and questions, must be post Xmas backlog.
Footplate next.
All the best
MD